THE LONG MARCH HOME

 

Mother Pollard was probably the oldest participant in the Montgomery Bus Boycott. Apparently no one knew her actual age or her first name, she was just called Mother. After several weeks of walking painfully to her destinations, people had urged Mother Pollard to drop out of the boycott and ride the buses. Mother Pollard refused. She made an offhand comment in response which has since become famous. She said: “My feets is tired, but my soul is rested.”

Tibet MarchersI think this is how the Rangzen Marchers must be feeling right now, feet(s) tired but hearts at rest, when they glimpse the snow capped peaks in the distance and know they are getting close to home. Looking through the photographs in their website (tibetanuprising.org) I notice a number of old palas and amalas among the marchers. One old man has a cane in his right hand a national flag in his left and a portrait of His Holiness hanging from his neck. But he looks good for another five hundred miles.

Most freedom struggles have at least one good march in their stories. There is of course Mao’s Long March, which has been much mythologized by the CCP, but whose core narrative has been effectively demolished a couple of years ago by Jung Chang and Jon Halliday in their Mao: The Unknown Story. They effectively proved that even the heroic battle at the Luding Bridge (which Tibetans call gya chamsam chenmo and believe was built by Thangton Gyalpo) was virtually invented – cut out of whole cloth – by communist propagandists.

SelmaBut marches in non-violent freedom movements though perhaps less spectacular or dramatic convince by their understated nature. I met an old black minister in Dharamshala once who had marched with Doctor King from Selma to Montgomery, Alabama. These marchers not only endured heat, dust and other hardships of the road, but were set upon by state troopers and deputies with dogs, billy clubs, tear gas and bull whips. Seventeen marchers were hospitalized and one was killed. After two more marches the conscience of the nation was awakened and President Lyndon Johnson signed the Voting Rights Act of 1965.

Then we have Gandhi’s Salt March, from his Sabarmati Ashram to the coastal village of Dandi in Gujurat (about 390 kilometers or 240 miles) on March 12, 1930. It was derided by many at the time, especially in the English language press in India. The ultra nationalists thought that such symbolic action was ridiculous and contemptible. Gandhi’s choice of the salt tax as a symbolic target of his march was initially met with incredulity even by the Working Committee of the Congress.

But the salt tax was a profound symbolic choice, since salt was used by nearly everyone in India. It represented 8.2% of the British Raj tax revenue, and most significantly hurt the poorest Indians the most. Gandhi felt that this protest would dramatize Indian Independence in a way that was meaningful to the lowliest Indians. It was also the first action to demonstrate Purna Swaraj or complete self-rule which was declared earlier that year, on January 26th, by the Indian National Congress.

The symbolism of the March to Tibet is in its destination. That is where the marchers, through their exertion and sacrifice, are telling us we must we must commit all our energy, all our resources, everything, to achieve the independence that Tibetans called out for in the streets of Lhasa, Labrang, Kanze and other places in Tibet, earlier this year.

The Salt March failed to win major concessions from the British, and 80, 000 Indian were jailed as a result. But the campaign had a significant effect on changing world and British attitudes toward Indian independence, and caused large numbers of Indians to actively join the fight for the first time.

I know some people have been skeptical of the March. A former TYC president made a dismissive comment about it in a meeting in New York this year. And perhaps there is some ground for a little skepticism. In 1995 Dharamshala politicians from the United Association (chigdril tsokpa) and the three regional parties (cholkha sum) organized a Peace March to Tibet. The goal was later switched to Delhi. Halfway, at Ambala, the march-leaders hustled everyone on buses claiming that they had to be in New Delhi to meet the Dalai Lama. Thupten Ngodup who had volunteered for the march, later expressed his strong disappointment to a friend.

But this time the Marchers have proved immensely courageous, determined and resourceful. I have lost count of the times that their leaders, or a contingent of the marchers, have been arrested. Somehow they keep coming back. When I saw the photograph of what seemed like at least a few thousand Indian policemen filling the side of a mountain road in Utterkhand, I thought it was all over. But I was wrong. Five non-Tibetan volunteers on the March were issued “Quit India” notices. Whether they’ve actually quit is not certain. The marchers also had the Indian authorities stopping their food supplies and impounding their trucks, but they seem to have overcome those problems as well. Probably the worst moment for the marchers must have been when the Dalai Lama ordered them to give up the march. His Holiness told the press (Reuters) that he thought the march was dangerous and pointless.

Of course it is dangerous business. One marcher has already died. If the Indian authorities allow them to cross the border, they could be shot by the Chinese. They would definitely be arrested and jailed. I am informed that tomorrow, Tuesday the 17th, is D–Day. The marchers will be arriving at Dharchula, the last border town before the “inner line” of the Indo-Tibet border. My informant tells me that “It seems that the police will definitely stop the marchers and arrest everyone here tomorrow.”

Yet I know that the march will somehow continue. I can’t tell you why, but I have absolute faith in the courage, determination and resourcefulness of the leaders and the participants of the March. All I ask of the readers is that he or she forward this article to as many friends and acquaintances, and bring as much public attention to this history making event. Go to the marcher’s website (tibetanuprising.org) and put in your greetings and encouragements. They should know that we are with them always.

I cannot help directly but tomorrow I am going to burn some juniper and sage and make a sangsol offering with my wife and kids. I will offer a prayer to all the old gods and goddesses of Tibet (the fierce gods who once gave us victory over the Tang Empire) to watch over the marchers, to protect our people and guard the integrity, the life-force (la) of our ancient nation against the gya-dre demons of China.

Among the marchers is an ex-paratrooper who has received a medal of valour from the prime minister of India for single-handedly wiping out two Pakistani bunkers at Kargil. Right now these Tibetans are marching peacefully for freedom. One day these same people could be marching with rifles. What happens will in large part be dictated by how China deals with its Tibet problem. But the March will go on.

Comments

  1. phuntsok J | June 16th, 2008 | 9:43 pm

    These marchers are amazing! I just saw a short documentary on the Marchers this weekend, It was done roughly, but it was the most moving, stirring thing I’ve seen in a quite a while. Seeing the faces of the marchers, hearing them speak their thoughts, and watching them endure their trials, and knowing this was all taking place right now. I think almost all in the room wept, but I’m not sure, cause my eyes were too blurry, and I sure wasn’t going to look around room and be noticed.
    The march organizer had sent this video, so that they could raise more funds, they were running low, since so many hundreds of the marchers had been arrested, and they had to be transported back and forth to continue the march. Please donate something when you get a chance, I’m sure the info should be on their website.

  2. Maura Moynihan | June 16th, 2008 | 10:24 pm

    When certain people advise myself and other friends of Tibet is “stop encouraging the Tibetans to protest” I reply; I don’t have to do anything, it is THEIR rally, I am just cheering them on. The Tibetan people, inside Tibet and around the world, have launched a global citizens insurrection against cruelty, oppression, the absolute power of the totalitarian state. I am humbled, inspired and above all motivated. Bring on the Rangzen Revolution!

  3. Sera Jampa | June 17th, 2008 | 12:21 am

    I also watched their video. Its really moving and energetic soul. I go through tibetuprising.com website daily and put up my comments to show my hearty support for them. I heard that many old lay people joined into this peaceful march, from mainly Kollegal Tibetan settlement camp and others. Most of the monks are from Sera Je monastery, as far as I know. Durin 17th Olympic torch in Delhi, I went there to join with protestor with some monks,although I donot get chance to enter in jail like others. During that time, I make short visit to the hall where marcher stay. Every face has changed, became black, slim, exhausted and pitiable. I am really moved by seeing them. I felt really glad when I saw again many of Sera monks that I knew.

    What I request others thru this site is that we the Tibetan people in India should try to put more pressure on Indian govt and other countries to have easy access for these peace marchers. But sadly we are not doing enough in showing support for them.

  4. Nyinjey | June 17th, 2008 | 4:35 am

    Hats off to the marchers, who have sacrificed everything for Tibetan freedom. They inspire all of us with their courage, patriotism and valor. Let us all join them in their efforts to liberate the Tibetan people who have suffered so much under the Chinese tyranny. I am so proud of them, because they have proved all skeptics, including myself, wrong by going ahead with their march. Unlike those in the past, the march this time is sincere and serious, not just a propaganda gimmick. No matter how much the PRC tries to stop them, they will remain defiant and move on with march to Freedom…Long live the marchers and may our collective dream to live in dignity in our country comes true….!

    Bod Gyalo, and thanks jamyangla for your encouraging article. Please keep on writing. We need alternative views, which are not just thoughtprovoking but also inspire and encourages us to think, reflect and if possible take action on Tibet….

  5. tsering topgyal | June 17th, 2008 | 7:58 am

    Maura Moynihan
    Thank you for your support,especially understanding that Tibetans have to lead the way in the struggle for Rangzen.

    Our Beloved Marchers
    They have given voice to our people in Tibet and for us in exile a lesson on perseverance towards our goals.

    No more should the day come where after the 10th March….. 11th March becomes just another day.

  6. Maura Moynihan | June 17th, 2008 | 8:29 pm

    A journalist friend of mine just interviewed the Chinese Consul General in New York City – he told her he was very upset about the Tibet demonstrations that occur daily in front of the Chinese Consulate. He said it was “embarrassing” and “why doesn’t the US government stop it?”
    So this tells us that our protests are having an impact and making China nervous.
    However, it appears that the press has dropped the Tibet story since the earthquake, the Chinese party line has gotten to alot of editors and reporters. So we have to keep on the heat –
    BRING ON THE RANGZEN REVOLUTION!

  7. Tsering | June 17th, 2008 | 9:56 pm

    Seeing those pola and mola’s picture, seeing the Black and white Gandhi’s picture, and Kings picture, I felt so sad. Where is our leader?????

  8. Sera Jampa | June 17th, 2008 | 11:36 pm

    There are some people who criticise NGOs for the continuous protest movement which does not bear any fruit on the main Tibet issue. And also on Rangzen activists for ineffective movement. They also claimed that the present ongoing dialogue since started from 2002 is directly the result of Middle Way policy, to garner the support from the general people for Middle Way policy.

    I think, these movements of NGO do bear fruit and it support for dialogue to process continuously. It push up the dialogue actually. Due to Chinese govt embarrassment in the world view and bad image, they are forced to make dialogue process to show the outside world that they are committee to solve Tibet issue peacefully. That is why, I request to each and every activist not to get discourage by such comments. Be more strengthened to your commitment when such criticism comes up.

  9. tsampa eater | June 19th, 2008 | 12:34 am

    The leaders are in a difficult position ever since they have decided to opt for an “autonomous” Tibet. Their options are limited when they are seeking “genuine autonomy” within the “framework of Chinese constitution”.

    The concept of autonomy itself is vague, the Chinese constitution does guarantee regional ethnic autonomy to the so-called minority nationalities in China. I am surprised that the Tibetan government in exile considers Tibetans to be one of the “minority” nationalities in China, reducing the status of Tibet to that of other “minorities” like Xinjiang and Inner Mongolia.

    It would do well for our leaders to remember that even the PRC leaders treat the Tibetans as different from other “minority” nationalities. Remember the 17 point agreement. It was signed only with the Tibetans.

    The leaders should struggle for Tibetan autonomy based on the concept that Tibet was once an independent nation. I know the leaders know this, but they should emphasise on this critical issue. They should use this as the only bargaining chip while negotiating with the Chinese. Alas that doesn’t seem to be the case, ever since Prof. Rinpoche became the PM. He keeps on using terms like “regional ethnic autonomy”, “minority nationality”, “Chinese constitution”, “masters of their own affairs”, “single administration for all the Tibetans”- a clear indication that the government endorses the status quo of Tibet…

    furthermore the appeal to not shout for Tibet’s independence during the demonstrations is really dangerous. Historical independence of Tibet is what makes us different from the Chinese and grants us the legitimate right to seek freedom and justice of Tibet…If this is denied, then there is no thing called “struggle of Tibet”…

  10. Hugh | June 19th, 2008 | 6:21 am

    I think what the marchers are doing is very brave. Someday, this event is going to be considered large in the annals of history. How many such direct actions were not paid attention to or largely ignored by the world at large, only to become the nucleus of a more energized liberation movement now celebrated as an important historical event?

    The Irish had marches too. They even had an uprising that was only brief news in world press at the time, and was even largely ignored by most Irish people. Until the day the revolutionaries of that uprising started being executed. Then the Irish woke up. And they freed themselves.

    I hope that no more of the Tibetan marchers die, as i wish no one to be killed, however, if they cross into Tibet, I know this is likely to happen to some of them. I wish there were more media there to cover this so that their actions and bravery can be shared with not only the world, but with the Tibetans across the world and inside of Tibet.

    I will mourn those lost, but I will be comforted by the fact the flame of human reason and freedom burns just as strongly as ever in their hearts, and it cannot ever be snuffed out.

  11. Bodjong | June 19th, 2008 | 6:35 am

    I have been thinking to write something on the pro-independence demonstrations that happened recently in our homeland Tibet. The demonstrations, which later turned to what the media called “riots”, as expected and feared, were brutally suppressed by the Chinese regime without even an iota of hesitation and doubt. But before I decided to pick up my pen and write on this, my conscience admonishes me to write something that is not just an outpour of emotions and anger against the Chinese, not just an outright condemnation (which the whole world except the Chinese side seems to be doing) but rather something that can be of little help to further advance the just and legitimate cause of Tibetan freedom.

    I believe one doesn’t have to be a rocket scientist to realize that even a mild criticism, leave alone peaceful and non-violent independence demonstrations like chanting “Tibet is independent”, “long live the Dalai Lama”, against the Chinese regime will subject one to rigorous imprisonment and, worse, violent deaths from the whole apparatus of the PLA machinery. Still Tibetans in Tibet, knowing full well the grave consequences of their actions, rose up against the Chinese and sacrificed their lives so that the spirit of Tibet remains alive and our children can live in peace, freedom and dignity.

    Tibetans living in free countries have done a lot to show their solidarity by organizing all kinds of non-violent protests to highlight the attention of the world community to the killing mines in Tibet. However, the question that remains to be asked among ourselves is this: have we, as Tibetans living in free countries, done enough for our brothers and sisters back in Tibet? Can we, as Tibetans who came into exile with the solemn pledge to work for Tibet’s freedom, do more than what we are doing right now?

    I have no doubt that the majority of us Tibetans in exile will have a negative answer to these questions. Deep down in our hearts and minds, whether we accept it or not, we know that we have not done enough for our cause. We know that we should do more, and wish to do more, but we seem to be, to quote His Holiness, helpless. In other words, our concern for Tibet remains just within the confines of our minds only!

    Speaking from the context of a nation, Tibetans killed by the Chinese in recent protests were our brothers and sisters, members of a same family called Bhod, sharing the same language, religion and culture. What should be our response, then, when, say our own family members, be it our age-old parents or just a newborn baby, is attacked by a rabies-infested dog? Should we counsel patience and compassion or should we strike the beast down without showing any mercy? I got my answer when I was watching a program on discovery channel last night. The program was about what the biologists often refer to as defensive mechanism that is inherent in every species when they are preyed upon by powerful predators.

    The program showed a bird guarding her chickens in the nest. A serpent suddenly pops up from nowhere to gobble up the little chicks. The mother, the bird, without any second thoughts about the venous snake, strikes back at the merciless predator!

  12. Tsering | June 19th, 2008 | 8:15 am

    BODJONG
    One question for you.
    I don’t share the same religion. Am I deserved to called Tibetan???

  13. Palgo Chenbo | June 19th, 2008 | 8:16 am

    Now stop the talkings. Plan, organize, train, and engage in action, hitting the enemies on their head and pierce their heart. Hit an strike where it pains.
    Can’t waste time anymore.

  14. Palgo Chenbo | June 19th, 2008 | 8:19 am

    Tsering,
    You are not debating buddhist logics at courtyard of Sera monastery.
    babe, grow up.

  15. door_ji | June 19th, 2008 | 12:26 pm

    hey,

    its not about religion! its all about being tibetan….so dont harbour that felling of are u known tibetan cause of u r religion….

  16. Sangay | June 19th, 2008 | 2:52 pm

    While leaders discourage us, but we continue to do what we have gotta do, be it a call for refraining from shouting ‘free tibet’ or this Long March…I sometime feel like children talking up the responsibility of running the house when their parents become careless. HHDL has said it and we have done it and doing it, that issue of tibet rests with tibetans, tibetans can only decide what to do…..

    Marchers, my prayers are with you!

  17. Maura Moynihan | June 19th, 2008 | 9:51 pm

    Yesterday the Free Tibet protestors marched through the streets of New York City. Manhattan’s multitudes smiled and waved and cheered us on.
    Never forget;
    The people of the world support Tibet.
    The Tibet movement has always been a people’s movement. Not governmental bodies, not corporations, but citizens. Therein lies its power.

  18. Bodjong | June 19th, 2008 | 10:50 pm

    Tsering la,

    To be Tibetan you don’t have to share the same religion. I mean you don’t have to be Buddhist, muslim, or christian. You can be an outright secular minded person. For your kind information, His Holiness, in his Guidelines for Future Tibetan polity, issued way back in 1991, clearly outlined that “future Tibet should be a secular, democratic entity, governed in accordance with the law”.

    I can only say that Tibet’s first king, our ancestor of ancestors, was not a Buddhist. But as Tibetan we should be a little different from others, especially from our Chinese. So, it would be nice for every Tibetan to atleast know the Tibetan language…

    I hope I gave your answer…

  19. Bodjong | June 19th, 2008 | 10:56 pm

    Pango Chenpo,

    We can learn some lessons from the Chinese revolutionaries themselves, how they overthrew the Manchus. The PRC will definitely breakup like all Chinese empires. We will have our opportunity. They only thing I am worried about is whether we we would be able to grab the opportunity, with both hands. Remember the year 1911, when the Chinese were driven out of Tibet. The thirteen Dalai Lama tried his best, but the three monasteries thrwated all his reformist plans by closing down the english medium schools…
    we should read about the Russian revolution, Peter the Great, American and French revolutions, the Meiji restoration, and about the Roman Empire…Time for Tibetans to change their worldview, to go beyond the Buddhist concept of interdependence. Otherwise we are doomed to fail once again…

  20. Tsering Choedon Lejotsang | June 19th, 2008 | 11:34 pm

    Bravo Bodjong, I couldn’t agree with you more!!
    The Tibetan language, secular minded, ability to grab the opportunity….all of what you wrote.

    Lejotsang

  21. Dava | June 20th, 2008 | 3:03 am

    Except for going beyond the Buddhist concept of interdependence. What a concept you have! A result of thinking?

  22. Bodjong | June 20th, 2008 | 5:15 am

    I always feel we need to do some introspection. Why were we reduced to being stateless citizens with no country of our own? I am sure there is something wrong in our world view. If that is the case then we need to change it. We can not cling to ideas that failed us to join the world of sovereign nations.

  23. palgochenbo | June 20th, 2008 | 6:56 am

    Hey Bojong,
    Tell me what”ideas”failed us?

  24. Rich | June 20th, 2008 | 10:11 am

    “Tsampa eater”, among the TGIE policies you mentioned, one I’d especially like to draw attention to is the idea of a “single administration for all the Tibetans”. I understand that the principle was created to build unity and assure that the negotiations would not “sell out” Amdo and half of Kham, but the particular form of the policy seems completely inept to me. Read literally, it sounds like if China offered to make each of Utsang, Amdo, and Kham separate fully-autonomous (or even fully independent!) political entities, Samdhong would reject the offer on account of it not being a “single administration”.

    Being serious, I doubt Samdhong or anyone in the TGIE would be so ridiculous as this, but the presence of poorly-worded and unnecessary preconditions in the negotiation policy surely isn’t doing any good to advance the progress of negotiation.

    In addition, demands for a “single administration” sound to the Chinese and to many third parties like an assertion that the TGIE wants themselves to be the future rulers of Tibet and places that wish above the wellbeing of the people of Tibet. I hope this is just an unfortunate misinterpretation, not actually such a selfish desire, but either way it’s counterproductive to negotiation.

    As a constructive suggestion, I believe it would make a lot more sense to throw away all demands of “single administration” and instead simply specify that the sought-for “meaningful autonomy” is to be negotiated simultaneously for all Tibetan “autonomous regions and prefectures”, without any precondition of a larger unified administrative structure.

    Forgive me if these comments seem unwelcome coming from a foreigner – especially one who thinks autonomy is a fairly unstrategic and ineffective goal to begin with. But to me it seems blatently obvious that local self-rule by Tibetans not tied-down by demands of loyalty to Beijing matters a lot more than the large-scale political structure and whether folks from Dharamsala are involved in it.

  25. Tenzin Desal | June 21st, 2008 | 5:10 am

    it can certainly get frustrating when Tibetans sandwiched between chinese hegemony and world’s diplomacy set out on an endeavour against the might of china’s regime. but while i was vacationing in Dharasala, the spirit of Tibetan independence is shared by people from virtually across the world. i am not confident about the sucess of this march but it has ignited an un-dousable fire in youths akin to me and for them our heart and hands will be held together -thankin and praying for their efforts.

  26. Bodjong | June 21st, 2008 | 5:46 am

    Last night I had an appointment with a Polish Journalist. We talked about Tibet, Tibet and Tibet. In fact it was I who did all the talking. To have an objective discussion on Tibet is one of the most difficult thing to do in this world. This is because the issue, especially for us Tibetans, is a very emotional one.
    Considering the precarious situation of us exiled Tibetans, the only pragmatic thing we can do for Tibet is talk and debate on it. In the process, we can hope to find a new way for Tibet. Some actions can also be taken, and is being taken by courageous Tibetans – some non-violent protests, every now and then.
    Such campaigns have been initiated ever since we were driven out of our homeland – way back in 1949. Its been a long time back now. Fifty years might not be a long time for a national liberation struggle. They say India fought for two hundred years before it became independent. But then we should also remember that it took just thirty odd years to completely change the face of China. The country was one of the poorest in the world when it was established in 1949. But now it is considered as the future superpower, overpowering even the mighty United States.
    Sadly, no concrete solution has been found for Tibet. Tibetans on both sides of the Himalayas continue to suffer severe repression and national humiliation. Democracy, human rights, economic development, global warming, rule of law, freedom, dignity – these are luxurious items for us.
    We don’t even have a secure base. We are not sure of what will happen tommorrow. Despite such tough conditions, Tibetans have so far kept the issue of Tibet alive. It has remained steadfast to its struggle for national freedom. China keeps on lecturing on “peace and stability” in Tibet. This is a clear indication that so far it has not been able to pacify Tibet.
    Although China controls Tibet physically thanks to its overwhelming force represented by the People’s Liberation Army and the People’s Armed Police, it has not been able to extinguish the flame of freedom that burns in the heart of every Tibetan. Be they communist cadres, monks, nuns, or common Tibetans, all of them know that Tibet is an occupied country. They know that the identity of Tibet can be secured only when the Chinese are driven out of Tibet.
    And herein lies the significance. As long as the spirit of the Tibetans last, as long as the will and aspiration to resist Chinese colonialism continues, there is always hope for Tibet.

  27. Hugh | June 21st, 2008 | 10:29 am

    Bodjong,

    Bravo!

  28. Tsering | June 21st, 2008 | 10:59 pm

    BODJONG
    You were talking blindly with your eyes open. If I don’t pray for Dalai lama, TGIE will treat me like it treated Dorjee Shugden worshipers. If i meet Dalai Lama and try to handshake with him, instead of bowing to him, people will kill me. Honestly, I don’t think we are ready for that yet. BODJONG you are just a HYPOCRITE PERSON.

  29. LAMA | June 21st, 2008 | 11:06 pm

    Check this out
    http://youtube.com/watch?v=f_xu6VYpQe0

    Watch, think and wake up from Non-violence(non-action) sweet dream. FREEDOM IS NOT FREE.
    At least we should try Gandhi’s non-vilonce action and stop begging for help like a Buddhist monk. No body will put “Free Tibet” in the bowl of Buddhist monk.

  30. Palden | June 22nd, 2008 | 12:04 am

    Tsering, I think it’s you who does not talk sense and lie with open eyes. You are also a camouglage…..

    Bodjong, great piece of writing. Tibetan people inside and outside did not loose hope nor their forgot their history, therefore, this feelings of “red faced Tibetan” from roof of the world will always resist imperial Chinese rule. We must understand that China is completely a unbalanced society, the perfect analogy is a piece of wood on the surface of ocean, the wood can go in any direction according to the wind, it can be float at one place if there is no wind. In the same token, a person can be a “martyar” today, but can be a villain and traitor tomorrow. Such a sense of abnormality is the part of Chinese people and soceity today. Hence, you never knew when the rays of hope shine from behind the dark cloud. Until then, we need to be more innovative and do our own part as the struggle of freedom passes from one generation to another generation.

    Pal

  31. Hugh | June 22nd, 2008 | 12:14 pm

    Tsering,

    Bodjong said nothing about the issues you raised. Why continue this game of straw men arguments?

  32. LAMA | June 23rd, 2008 | 10:25 am

    HUGH
    I can see Tsering’s point. Hugh please do not force anyone in this forum to do or not to do!. This is a disucussion board. Any information is valuable.
    We are definetly fed up with propagandas from both sides(CHinese and TGIE)

  33. Lobsang | June 24th, 2008 | 12:14 am

    Whatever the Lama, Tsering or Tsering Choedon Lejotsang, it seems they are the same people disguised in different names beating away from the main discussion and unnecessarily highlighting the issues which is not mentioned here to get us away from our main Goal, aspiration or dream of Rangzen.
    They are I think either Shugden cult supporter or Communist paid instigator.

  34. Hugh | June 24th, 2008 | 6:33 am

    Lama,

    Well if you can see Tsering’s point, then good for you. I didn’t and thought it was an unfair strawman argument. In no way does my questioning of this imply that some one should be forced to do or not do anything. So please refrain from putting words in my mouth. I can be wordy enough as it is, thank you.

  35. bodjong | June 24th, 2008 | 7:08 am

    Tsering,

    I would love to meet you over a cup of tea or a glass of beer. I feel we can have a good conversation. Whether you agree with me or not, I think there are so many converging ideas between us. I live in Dharamsala….Hope to bump against you in hotel tibet

  36. Tsering Choedon Lejotsang | June 24th, 2008 | 9:14 am

    Dear Lobsang,

    I am not Lama or Tsering or Chinese.
    What makes you think that I am one of the above?

    Did I say anything about Shugden?

    Please do not accuse people of having said something that they haven’t.

    If you disagree with any of my comments, then please refute the specific points.
    Otherwise don’t go around making blanket statements and accusing people of being this or that.

    Also I mention my full name when I comment. Do not go around mistaking every Tserings, or Choedons with me.

    Tsering Choeden Lejotsang.

    Also what gives you the right to make judgements?

  37. Posa | June 24th, 2008 | 4:08 pm

    Jamyangla created this forum for discussion, issuing from his critical writings. Please readers and commentors do not spoil this atmosphere by indugling in your personal squibble. Respond to his writings and thoughts, rather sharing stupid comments among your selfs, which doesnt make any sense.

    Jamyang la’s last sentence is very bold statement, do any of you see the possibility of reviving Tibetan’s armed resistance, that was disbanded in Nepal in late 1970s. If Jamyang la is to lead such a struggle i will be the first to join.

  38. Hugh | June 24th, 2008 | 6:37 pm

    Posa,

    Of course armed resistance is possible, and may even be necessary. Reviving it is certainly both possible and likely, given today’s political climate.

    The issues are what shape it would take and what strategies and tactics such resistance would practice. Obviously, the Chinese have the big guns and planes and a whole plethora of men and supplies for those men. So what possible tactics would any armed Tibetan resistance take?

    Obviously we wouldn’t know exactly until/unless such a time comes, but I see that infrastructure will be very important. Roads and airfields. A corollary to this would be the settlers and their businesses. Obviously enough of those would need to be disrupted so that the colony grinds to a halt.

    It would be hard to say if the PLA have any contingencies for such a thing happening. But underestimating them would be fatal, since they pretty much can lockdown any populated areas.

    I don’t know for sure. Anyone here have any field experience, or knowledge about other national liberation movements?

  39. Rich | June 24th, 2008 | 10:44 pm

    If anyone does have such experience, I don’t think a public blog is the proper place to discuss it…

  40. bodjong | June 24th, 2008 | 10:52 pm

    Hugh,

    How about kidnappings and assasination plots? Children of Zhang Zhing Li should be kidnapped and then he will understand why his hard line policies are not viable for Tibet….

    Even the Tibetan colloborators like Ragdi and passang should be killed. They are the biggest traitors, more than the alien Chinese….!

  41. Tsering | June 25th, 2008 | 10:33 pm

    Wow. Now PALDEN accused me “camouglage” spy whatever, Bodjong threatened me. What next? Dharamsala people????
    That was Why i said, people from Dharamsala are exactly like Chinese communist people. No wonder, we lost Tibet. I just want to share one word with you guys.

    Tibet belongs to Tibetans in Tibet.

  42. bodjong | June 25th, 2008 | 11:24 pm

    Hey Tsering,

    How can you say I threatened you…I said lets have a cup of tea or beer together…Looks like you don’t have the guts to talk face to face…You only like to shoot in the darkness…Shows how defensive and inconfident you are….Why don’t you built wall ala “great wall of China” around you?

  43. Hugh | June 26th, 2008 | 6:20 am

    Rich,

    Obviously, anyone involved with ground actions wouldn’t be indiscreet enough to post them on a public forum. I was just calling for discussion in response to Posa. I think it is a useful discussion and can illuminate certain points. The most important of which is that China is not an indestructible power, nor is the myth of Tibet’s eventual assimilation into China necessarily one that people need agree with.

    Bodjong,

    I wouldn’t know myself if such plots would benefit. If they are to be acted on, the tactical outlook must be applied. If the issue is to frighten Chinese settlers in Tibet, make them feel unsafe as long as they remain colonists, then I can see the benefit of such actions.

  44. Bangle | July 1st, 2008 | 9:32 am

    I love to hear the ‘courage’ and ‘bravery’ shown by those who wrote here. Big words but no solid direction. If all of you think you can banish the Chinese from China (or Tibet), that you are just making yourself a laughing stock. For reality sake, we need to work and cooperate closely with the Chinese to achieve a better solution to the problem. Otherwise, you can all dream on….

  45. Rich | July 1st, 2008 | 5:54 pm

    Bangle, if you don’t have anything useful to say, don’t waste people’s time posting. Empires fall and when the time comes Tibet will be ready. Go laugh to yourself and we’ll see who’s still laughing when the value of all your investments in that wretched country crashes to $0.

  46. Bangle | July 2nd, 2008 | 4:25 am

    Rich,

    Alright, I presume you are going to wait another 500 years before the next crash for the current Chinese empire. Or it may not even crash at all as there is no longer any more invaders like Mongolians, or Manchurians. You want to wait for years to come… go ahead… by then you need to guess what is going to happen to Tibet.

  47. Rich | July 2nd, 2008 | 4:32 pm

    Bangle, nothing in China is remotely sustainable. It’s a near thermodynamic impossibility for China’s 1.3 billion people to have the standard of living their elite have, much less the sort Americans and Europeans have, without aggressive and likely violent expansionism. The resources simply do not exist, and the way China is using them at present, they’ll be living in deserts and toxic wastelands in 20 years. China has nothing of value except its population (which is valuable mostly because China considers its people expendable and is willing to use them as a threat to its neighbors), and the rest of the world’s value on human life that prevents us from taking action that would lead to massive Chinese deaths.

    Something has to give in the next few decades. There’s no easy out. This is not only China’s problem but a world problem; however, China’s policy of brainwashing (with mixed success) 1/5 of the world’s population has made it astronomically worse by making it virtually impossible to reason with them in regards to creating a sustainable world where human rights and dignity are respected.

    So yes, I think China will collapse, or else we’ll be swarmed by red-flag toting thugs like the ones who attacked Tibetans and supporters around the world during the torch relay. Given the choice, I’m much more willing to sacrifice China than the world of free information flow where we have some hope of one day honoring every human being’s rights and dignity. And I hope world leaders will make that decision too, if it comes down to it. There’s still also hope that China can change direction before it’s too late, but I’m not holding my breath. If China lasts 500 years then humanity is doomed.

  48. Jeff Bowe | July 3rd, 2008 | 6:32 am

    Rich, perhaps ‘Bangle’ is uneducated in the history and dynamics of struggles for national liberation? Otherwise he would be aware that the people of Ireland conducted a war of resistance for over 800 years to regain their independence.

    That continues to this day, albeit minus the armed conflict, and will continue until all Eíre is free and united.

    Keep the Rangzen fires burning.

  49. Chopathar | July 7th, 2008 | 1:31 pm

    Forty US Congress members signed a document three years ago stating that if the Chinese Government refuses to solve the Tibet issue in three years, the USA must admit Tibet as an independent Nation under the Tibetan government. After that, European Congress members signed a similar document too.

    We have to follow through with it.

    Best wishes.

    Chopathar

  50. Jeff Bowe | July 8th, 2008 | 5:15 am

    Indeed such ‘commitments ‘ must be rigorously tested to ensure that the Tibetan people are not being served political platitudes. Both the US Congress and EU Parliament should be pressed to respond.

    That said we must consider the political objectives and limitations of those Tibetans who enaged at that level of debate. Unfortunately one cannot imagine such prominent TGIE representatives demanding Congress to now acknowledge Tibetan independence.

    If anything Lodi Gyari and his team are engaged in an active effort to surrender entirely Tibetan nationhood.

    That being the case any pressure upon the US or Europe to honour previous assurances on Tibet’s independence must come from the wider community of Tibetans and their supporters.

  51. religion is poison | July 8th, 2008 | 1:15 pm

    Chopathar

    Don’t hold your breath on some “commitment” from either US Congress or EU Parliament, politicians always play both sides. Elected officials want big business contract from China to benefit their constituents but at the same time they want to look good on issues like Tibet, human right or whatever, from time to time they will cosponsor some bill targeting China proposed by their hard line colleagues, why not? It’s a free ride, free camouflage. A recent example is Diane Feistein, usually labeled as a pro-China US senator, cosponsored a bill to demand setting up a US consulate in Lhasa, there is no chance China will accept it but this bill can help her to look strong. Would China be offended by her? Of course not, Chinese government understands it. It takes two people to play sea-saw.

  52. Chopathar | July 9th, 2008 | 11:22 am

    Envoy Lodi Gyaltsen Gyari ,Kelsang Gyaltsen,Sonam N.Dagpo, Bhuchung K. Tsering, Sino-Tibetan Negotiations.

    Do:1=play sea-saw=0
    Re:2=play sea-saw=0
    Mi:3=play sea-saw=0
    Fa:4=play sea-saw=0
    So:5=play sea-saw=0
    La:6=play sea-saw=0
    Shi:7=play sea-saw=0

    Chopathar

  53. Dava | July 29th, 2008 | 8:20 am

    Dear Religion is Poison,

    Wrong. If you knew anything about Tibetan culture Chö and Bön, you would know that the afflictive emotions – nyomong – are what poisons our lives more than anything else. Of course they can get mixed up with religion, which is perhaps the most potent kind of poison. But Buddhism hardly recommends this, exactly the contrary. But perhaps by religion you are thinking of Christianity or something? Imho, and offered only as such.

    Politics is opium for the upper crust.

    Dava

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