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	<title>Comments on: JN at March 10 Rally in San Francisco (2009)</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.jamyangnorbu.com/blog/2009/03/24/572/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.jamyangnorbu.com/blog/2009/03/24/572/</link>
	<description>Jamyang Norbu's blog</description>
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		<title>By: Golok Ambum</title>
		<link>http://www.jamyangnorbu.com/blog/2009/03/24/572/#comment-4748</link>
		<dc:creator>Golok Ambum</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 Nov 2009 08:43:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jamyangnorbu.com/blog/?p=572#comment-4748</guid>
		<description>Mipham.

Of course it is not the Prime Minister, but someone using his name and posting from Brooklyn.

Golok Ambum, Webmaster</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mipham.</p>
<p>Of course it is not the Prime Minister, but someone using his name and posting from Brooklyn.</p>
<p>Golok Ambum, Webmaster</p>
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		<title>By: Mipham</title>
		<link>http://www.jamyangnorbu.com/blog/2009/03/24/572/#comment-4746</link>
		<dc:creator>Mipham</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 09 Nov 2009 02:37:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jamyangnorbu.com/blog/?p=572#comment-4746</guid>
		<description>I want ask the webmaster Golok la regarding the authencity of the comment # 54. Is it really our Prime Minister who has posted the comment? If so, then it&#039;s really a good beginning of Tibetan Democracy in exile.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I want ask the webmaster Golok la regarding the authencity of the comment # 54. Is it really our Prime Minister who has posted the comment? If so, then it&#8217;s really a good beginning of Tibetan Democracy in exile.</p>
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		<title>By: tundup</title>
		<link>http://www.jamyangnorbu.com/blog/2009/03/24/572/#comment-4741</link>
		<dc:creator>tundup</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 08 Nov 2009 22:43:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jamyangnorbu.com/blog/?p=572#comment-4741</guid>
		<description>Hello Jamyangla,

If you want to know what some young overseas Chinese was reading on Tibet in 2008, check out this &quot;history lesson&quot;.

http://www.chinesewithoutborders.org/downloads/Seminars/01/Seminar01_TangTuboHistory_English.pdf</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hello Jamyangla,</p>
<p>If you want to know what some young overseas Chinese was reading on Tibet in 2008, check out this &#8220;history lesson&#8221;.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.chinesewithoutborders.org/downloads/Seminars/01/Seminar01_TangTuboHistory_English.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://www.chinesewithoutborders.org/downloads/Seminars/01/Seminar01_TangTuboHistory_English.pdf</a></p>
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		<title>By: Sangay</title>
		<link>http://www.jamyangnorbu.com/blog/2009/03/24/572/#comment-3653</link>
		<dc:creator>Sangay</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Apr 2009 14:00:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jamyangnorbu.com/blog/?p=572#comment-3653</guid>
		<description>Hugh, 

You are right.  It stuns me beyond my belief when i see some Tibetan Buddhism followers say they dont care about the political matters of Tibet, but only its religion.  It&#039;s like saying I love orange, but I don&#039;t care to put water to its tree.   

Tibet&#039;s battle against China is not only a battle for independence of a nation, but also for the survival and preservation of the very religion they are fond of and practising.  Saying &quot;Free Tibet&quot; is not akin to saying &quot;yes, we can&quot; during president Obama&#039;s presidential campaign.  It&#039;s much more than that.  These dharma practitioners have no clue what they are saying. Pathetic.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hugh, </p>
<p>You are right.  It stuns me beyond my belief when i see some Tibetan Buddhism followers say they dont care about the political matters of Tibet, but only its religion.  It&#8217;s like saying I love orange, but I don&#8217;t care to put water to its tree.   </p>
<p>Tibet&#8217;s battle against China is not only a battle for independence of a nation, but also for the survival and preservation of the very religion they are fond of and practising.  Saying &#8220;Free Tibet&#8221; is not akin to saying &#8220;yes, we can&#8221; during president Obama&#8217;s presidential campaign.  It&#8217;s much more than that.  These dharma practitioners have no clue what they are saying. Pathetic.</p>
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		<title>By: Hugh</title>
		<link>http://www.jamyangnorbu.com/blog/2009/03/24/572/#comment-3632</link>
		<dc:creator>Hugh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Apr 2009 01:53:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jamyangnorbu.com/blog/?p=572#comment-3632</guid>
		<description>Prescott,

Yes the 10th downfall. This caused much argument between me and other American Vajrayana practitioners, when i was very vocal last year about what was happening in Tibet. One person had the audacity to tell me that i was getting mixed up in worldly troubles. So I told him to wake up, since the world is where we live. And Buddhism is no excuse for avoiding the world (though many imagine it can be just that). In fact if one practices Buddhism sincerely, there is no escape from this world. This is where we are and who we are. And if some people want to imagine that they can escape this and chant away the badness, then they are what the old Greeks called &quot;lotus eaters&quot; and cannot be taken seriously.

LOL

I hope this drivel of mine made some sense.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Prescott,</p>
<p>Yes the 10th downfall. This caused much argument between me and other American Vajrayana practitioners, when i was very vocal last year about what was happening in Tibet. One person had the audacity to tell me that i was getting mixed up in worldly troubles. So I told him to wake up, since the world is where we live. And Buddhism is no excuse for avoiding the world (though many imagine it can be just that). In fact if one practices Buddhism sincerely, there is no escape from this world. This is where we are and who we are. And if some people want to imagine that they can escape this and chant away the badness, then they are what the old Greeks called &#8220;lotus eaters&#8221; and cannot be taken seriously.</p>
<p>LOL</p>
<p>I hope this drivel of mine made some sense.</p>
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		<title>By: Pema T.</title>
		<link>http://www.jamyangnorbu.com/blog/2009/03/24/572/#comment-3585</link>
		<dc:creator>Pema T.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Apr 2009 17:43:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jamyangnorbu.com/blog/?p=572#comment-3585</guid>
		<description>Billk,

For you information, this forum is made available for all and sundry, and everyone has the right to express their opinion. Your job is to comment; be it in English or in Tibetan and you don&#039;t need to bother whether someone is Tibetan or others. 

Anywhere you have a good friend in Tsering Choedon Lejotsang.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Billk,</p>
<p>For you information, this forum is made available for all and sundry, and everyone has the right to express their opinion. Your job is to comment; be it in English or in Tibetan and you don&#8217;t need to bother whether someone is Tibetan or others. </p>
<p>Anywhere you have a good friend in Tsering Choedon Lejotsang.</p>
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		<title>By: Prescott</title>
		<link>http://www.jamyangnorbu.com/blog/2009/03/24/572/#comment-3276</link>
		<dc:creator>Prescott</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Apr 2009 20:29:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jamyangnorbu.com/blog/?p=572#comment-3276</guid>
		<description>Hugh, let&#039;s go a step further than the bodhisattva vows.  Almost without exception, Tibetans are Vajrayana Buddhists, even if nominally.  In this tradition, there are 14 root vows to be upheld.  The 10th downfall, which you can find published in various places on the web and therefore is not so secret, is:

&quot;Being unwilling to save sentient beings although one has the ability to do so - to refrain from forceful activity when needed so as to overcome destructive influences due to negative energies.&quot;

So a Vajrayana practitioner is actually oathbound to engage in forceful activity like violence if he/she has the ability to do so and clearly ascertains that it is necessary to overcome demonic forces.  This could reasonably involve everything from ritually exorcising a demon, to beating up a rapist before he gets to his prey, to joining the army to fight World War II Nazis, to resisting the Communist Chinese occupation.

Surely the Chinese military apparatus and government count as demonic forces, which may explain why various monks and incarnations left the robes to take up arms against them.

The myth of the &quot;peaceful&quot; Tibetan people is a New Age fantasy that actually flies in the face of Buddhist tradition, which allows for forceful action on both the sutric and tantric levels, when there will be benefit from it.  It&#039;s a pretty tricky point, but there are lots of examples from Tibetan history, including the previous lives of the Buddha himself, not to mention the assassin Lhalung Pelgyi Dorje, or more recently, some of the lamas who fought the Chinese in the 50&#039;s.

-Prescott</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hugh, let&#8217;s go a step further than the bodhisattva vows.  Almost without exception, Tibetans are Vajrayana Buddhists, even if nominally.  In this tradition, there are 14 root vows to be upheld.  The 10th downfall, which you can find published in various places on the web and therefore is not so secret, is:</p>
<p>&#8220;Being unwilling to save sentient beings although one has the ability to do so &#8211; to refrain from forceful activity when needed so as to overcome destructive influences due to negative energies.&#8221;</p>
<p>So a Vajrayana practitioner is actually oathbound to engage in forceful activity like violence if he/she has the ability to do so and clearly ascertains that it is necessary to overcome demonic forces.  This could reasonably involve everything from ritually exorcising a demon, to beating up a rapist before he gets to his prey, to joining the army to fight World War II Nazis, to resisting the Communist Chinese occupation.</p>
<p>Surely the Chinese military apparatus and government count as demonic forces, which may explain why various monks and incarnations left the robes to take up arms against them.</p>
<p>The myth of the &#8220;peaceful&#8221; Tibetan people is a New Age fantasy that actually flies in the face of Buddhist tradition, which allows for forceful action on both the sutric and tantric levels, when there will be benefit from it.  It&#8217;s a pretty tricky point, but there are lots of examples from Tibetan history, including the previous lives of the Buddha himself, not to mention the assassin Lhalung Pelgyi Dorje, or more recently, some of the lamas who fought the Chinese in the 50&#8242;s.</p>
<p>-Prescott</p>
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		<title>By: Hugh</title>
		<link>http://www.jamyangnorbu.com/blog/2009/03/24/572/#comment-3187</link>
		<dc:creator>Hugh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Apr 2009 23:45:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jamyangnorbu.com/blog/?p=572#comment-3187</guid>
		<description>Another Aussie Speaks,

You may perhaps know that one of the root downfalls of one who has taken bodhisattva vows is to allow dharma and its followers be destroyed. It is explicit in its implications that defense, even if violence is used, is correct - while lamentable - still correct. It is in fact in alignment with the idea that freedom to live in peace sometimes means defending oneself and one&#039;s community (or nation) from aggression. Non-violence should never be imagined as more than a tactic in resistance. It is an outlook and way of life, but in resistance contexts, should be seen as a means to an end. To be cynical, it can be biding one&#039;s time and wearing down the oppressor, to where a revolution against them is nearly bloodless (as has happened in some post-communist European nations). Or it can be something else entirely - but greater men and women ponder this and i admit my inexperience in much of it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Another Aussie Speaks,</p>
<p>You may perhaps know that one of the root downfalls of one who has taken bodhisattva vows is to allow dharma and its followers be destroyed. It is explicit in its implications that defense, even if violence is used, is correct &#8211; while lamentable &#8211; still correct. It is in fact in alignment with the idea that freedom to live in peace sometimes means defending oneself and one&#8217;s community (or nation) from aggression. Non-violence should never be imagined as more than a tactic in resistance. It is an outlook and way of life, but in resistance contexts, should be seen as a means to an end. To be cynical, it can be biding one&#8217;s time and wearing down the oppressor, to where a revolution against them is nearly bloodless (as has happened in some post-communist European nations). Or it can be something else entirely &#8211; but greater men and women ponder this and i admit my inexperience in much of it.</p>
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		<title>By: Hugh</title>
		<link>http://www.jamyangnorbu.com/blog/2009/03/24/572/#comment-3186</link>
		<dc:creator>Hugh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Apr 2009 23:34:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jamyangnorbu.com/blog/?p=572#comment-3186</guid>
		<description>I_Believe, 

On March 26th (sorry, i&#039;ve been away for some days), you wrote about Chenresig and Jampelyang being blood brothers. Doubtful, but I get your point as far as Buddhist traditional belief is concerned. You however conflate some history and much Buddhist development in equating Jampelyang (Manjushri) with China, as a parallel to Chenresig (Avalokiteshvara) with Tibet.  Jampelyang or Manjushri was the &quot;patron&quot; of the people once known as the Jurchen, who became known as the Manchu just about when they conquered China. As much as the Manchurian rulers became sinified, the people were not Chinese, and the Buddhism practiced was lost along with Manchurian culture and language.

Equating Manjushri as patron of China, with Chenresig as patron of Tibet is silly and ignores the history, as well as Buddhist teachings. 

Just thought to point this out.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I_Believe, </p>
<p>On March 26th (sorry, i&#8217;ve been away for some days), you wrote about Chenresig and Jampelyang being blood brothers. Doubtful, but I get your point as far as Buddhist traditional belief is concerned. You however conflate some history and much Buddhist development in equating Jampelyang (Manjushri) with China, as a parallel to Chenresig (Avalokiteshvara) with Tibet.  Jampelyang or Manjushri was the &#8220;patron&#8221; of the people once known as the Jurchen, who became known as the Manchu just about when they conquered China. As much as the Manchurian rulers became sinified, the people were not Chinese, and the Buddhism practiced was lost along with Manchurian culture and language.</p>
<p>Equating Manjushri as patron of China, with Chenresig as patron of Tibet is silly and ignores the history, as well as Buddhist teachings. </p>
<p>Just thought to point this out.</p>
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		<title>By: Billk</title>
		<link>http://www.jamyangnorbu.com/blog/2009/03/24/572/#comment-3156</link>
		<dc:creator>Billk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Apr 2009 01:38:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.jamyangnorbu.com/blog/?p=572#comment-3156</guid>
		<description>Jamyang-la and Golok-la

Is it possible to have Tibetan text on this site? We could ask Umeylam etc to write us a little something in Tibetan to prove they really are Tibetan and I couold get some reading practice.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jamyang-la and Golok-la</p>
<p>Is it possible to have Tibetan text on this site? We could ask Umeylam etc to write us a little something in Tibetan to prove they really are Tibetan and I couold get some reading practice.</p>
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