Our very own Tenpa Gapshi la has written a very discerning and balanced article on the Katri elections, with emphasis on the results of the preliminary elections. I highly recommend it to everyone. Read it at http://bit.ly/9L1xNT
I haven’t seen as much genuine and animated discussion about our elections and our democracy anywhere as on the comment section of this blog. Thank you everyone for all your contributions: pro, anti, for, against, undecided and even plain crazy. Thanks.
that was a great piece, and if i may add a must read for people in Tethong la camp to re-position their strategy. Tethong la is certainly not the best, but given the choices we have no one is better than him in terms of entrusting the Kalon Tripa seat at this time. I hate to see him lose.
Is this called a balanced article? Maybe it’s true for those who regularly walks wobbling even on a plain ground. It’s really a plain crazy. Maybe Pho Gapshi la is wobbling and wandering around his Kudrak Tethong la.
Read the one on Tibetan Political Review.
Clear & Precise.
Tenpa is crystal clear and Arihant as usual is just plain crazy. VOTE!
Very balanced article, indeed. Mr. Gapshi, good job, keep it up. We need more people like you.
What is missing in his article is that Tethong la supporters are all timid. Besides, Tethong la does not have the campaign money to go everywhere he wants to. He spent his life for the service of our nation as a Tibetan govt. official. Now, the supporters are charged up and we were able to raise money for him, and Tethong is also charged up. He will campaign more this time. I encourage people to support Tethong la’s campaign financially.
I can tell you this much about Tenzin Tethong; He is really an honest person, visionary leader, reliable, respected, and friendly person. He doesn’t believe in backroom dealings and phony promises even if it costs him the katri position.
That is impressive and he represents a proud product of Tibet who carries HHDL’s advices not in his mouth but through such action.
Victory to Tethong at Last.
I would say he has put in enough efforts to write a fairly balanced article. But again, he fails to appreciate LS’s academic achievement, though not as great as Karmay, Dnorbu and Shakya, but decent enough to be proud of in a Tibetan politician/leader!
I hope to see Tethong la writing on aspects of Tibetan political struggle one day!
Comparison between the two in this field, I think, will help us better in ‘judging’ LS’s writings/academic scholarship.
I’m since several years in the recruiting business and involved in selections of the right candidates for all sorts of positions, among others also for leadership roles at all levels.
What I know for sure is that a PhD should never be the sole criteria to place someone in a leadership role, whether acquired at Yale, Harvard, Stanford, Oxford, Cambridge or any other top university, especially if someone is already at the age of 40 and cannot provide any proper work history beside a PhD. I’m well aware of Harvard being one of the best universities, but I’m also aware that a Harvard degree/PhD does not automatically qualify someone for a leadership position.
I often have applicants coming fresh from the university with one or two PhDs, but the average age is approx. 26 respectively 28. Even with a PhD at this early age they are expected to first do some basic work and proof their ability to implement their knowledge in the ‘real’ daily business/life and achieve more than their peers in order to be considered for leadership roles.
What worries me in Dr. L.S.’s case is that I couldn’t find in his CV any sort of achievements/experiences/publications, beside the PhD, which might qualify him for the Kalon Tripa role nor could I conclude from the interviews and discussions that he might be someone with excellent leadership skills. There is no doubt that he is smart, but how can someone who never ever really has done anything beside a PhD dare to run for Kalon Tripa. It’s like a bad joke.
Please wake up – in 5 years it might be too late to correct our mistake. We owe our Tibetans brothers and sisters back in our home country to vote in a responsible manner and for someone whom we all can rely on, whom we can entrust the future of 6 million Tibetans, especially of those in Tibet, whether this person is from Kham, Uetsang or Amdo. Also I don’t really understand the issue of some people with Kudraks. We don’t have any Kudraks since 1959. We are all refugees and in the same boat, Kudraks or non-Kudraks. Therefore it’s the person and his/her achievements which count today. All Tibetans serving our exile government and our cause in one or the other way are today’s Kudraks.
I’m actually very much for a change in our policy and would love to support a young candidate, but Dr. L.S. is definitely not the young candidate, I’m looking for.
@ Arihant
Boooooooooooooooooooooo….
Some people are not aware that Tethong was one of the Principles in the founding of International Campaign for Tibet, Tibet Fund & initiating the process for the lobby of the 1000 visas to the US etc.
His supporters did not reach out to the ‘far flung’ Tibetan settlements in exile India.
many belittle Tethong la’s academic credentials…saying he’s only a high school graduate or this and that. that’s correct. but here’s someting to cogitate people: why would Stanford, a university as prestigeous as Harvard, hire a guy with just a high school diploma to teach there???
now take the Lobsang Sangay hat off ur head for a minute and think, doesn’t that tell something extraordinary about this man??? I can go further and say that his induction by Standord is in a way is a message that universty degrees don’t necessarily mean everything! there is something else!
Lobsang Sangay’s academic credentials maybe impressive, but Tethong is no less either i think. While LS la has PhD..but Tethong la, without having a Phd, he has ‘one’! sometime, the latter impresses me more!
@Sangay,
Can you show me some writings by Tethong-la, on the basis of which I can ‘judge’ his academic/intellectual talents?
Even one article on Tibetan affairs?
But I agree I find him a decent and honest guy. But leadership needs more than that!
I have known TNT for over two decades and LS for about a decade. Both have unique skills and qualifications.
TNT is an incredible visionary, easy to get along and very down to earth. His accomplishments of proven record speak for itself… founding of Tibetan Youth Congress, Sheja, Tibet Fund, International Campaign for Tibet, 1000 Tibetans to the US among many others — all initiatives that have shaped the exile community. TNT needs a strong team of people to work with him. I believe we are in a different environment where he can truly bring about many more changes to prepare us for the post HHDL difficulties.
TNT is not very aggressive and appears bound by our “Yarab Choesang” conduct that is part of his upbringing. He has not been very good at articulating his thoughts and have relied on the records speaking for itself.
LS has brought about enthusiasm to this election. He has managed to engage many who were disengaged. He has been extremely successful in connecting with the people with his populist positions. His proposals are well thought out and if successful, are the right antidotes for the problems that we will face – Tibetan unity and keeping hope alive. Unfortunately his lack of any past experience leaves the big question as to whether he will be able to accomplish any of his ‘promises’. As an academic researcher, he has failed at the very thing that an academic is measured – published papers. His website lists selected writings, most of which are letters to editors or very basic and general articles. There is not a single scholarly work in any of his writings. If we are to judge his ability by his record so far, then there is a lot to be desired. His ability to shift his positions based on public opinion is his strength with the voters and a major concern for those of us who have been involved for a very long time. As such, majority of his supporters are new to the cause and in involvement.
There is not too much difference philosophically on what LS has articulated and what TNT believes. After all, who can disagree with the motherhood issues.
Interestingly, in this election the ‘scholar’ from Harvard has excelled as a politician and the career diplomat and politician has demonstrated himself more as a statesman.
TNT is the best available candidate for the current time. (I don’t see anyone else within our community who is better for the job at this time).
My wish would be to see TNT as the Kalon Tripa that includes LS as a member of the Kashag. LS will be able to gain the necessary experience while working with a very seasoned, progressive statesman like TNT.
Knowing LS, I doubt if he will accept such an arrangement.
I should add a comment regarding those who have criticized TNT for having “only a high school diploma”.
It is an extremely unfair criticism. TNT along with his brother Tenzin Geyche la, Jamyang Norbu la, Lhasang Tsering la and others sacrificed their own formal academic career by serving the Tibetan society when no one was around. I can say with full certainty that all four of the people I have named are far more well read and spoken than any Tibetan PhDs that I know including LS.
Often those who trumpet LS’s Harvard PhD against TNT’s high school cannot properly spell Harvard or Stanford.
I was really taken back by LS’ claim at TIPA debate that he spent the last 15 years in the US as a service to the Tibetan cause and NOT for personal gain. His response followed TNT’s explanation that he left Dharamsala for personal reasons and the reality of raising a young family.
HTGT,
I feel you…I was of the same opinion as you. Tethong la may have written thought provoking articles about Tibet which maybe lying somewhere in his study if not in LTWA…i don’t know, i have never come across them. i dont have anything to give you.
but then i think the other way and try to get the bigger picture, and my inner voice tells me, this guy must have done and said and demonstrated more than writing monographs or mere articles! I m sure after all you know Stanford, given it’s standing in academic circle, must have high standard when it comes hiring someone to teach them. either they must have ‘waived’ Tethong la’s writings because his record spoke for itself….or his schorlarly articles about Tibet must be lying somewhere in the Human Resources dept of Standford!
@HTGT,
What we are trying to say is, just as in corporate recruitment, one tries to use past performance as a strong predictor or determinant of future success/performance. Since LS’ only career is at an academic institution as a senior research fellow, the question of academic publication is the only relevant way to judge his past performance. It, in itself, is not a qualification for the KT job.
As for Tethong, there is a mountain of evidence of his ability to get the job done. His job @ Stanford does not require him to publish. And using that thought process, his success of creating TYC, Sheja, Tibet Fund, 1000 Tibetans to the US, ICT and his 40 years service to the TGIE are the most relevant tools.
If I am correct – Tethong is a visiting ‘Tibet’ scholar @ Stanford. Something of a ‘Tibetologist’? The required knowledge gained over the course of his career-life; & the tenure as Kalon Tripa being one important credential.
And LS the scholar has emerged as a very ‘hands on’ excellent politician, campaigner, & people person.
I admire TC la’s honesty and modesty. He said he is not alone in achieving all those important tasks such as finding TYC, Sheja and the American resettlement project. There are many others who were with him.
We really need to reflect deeper to understand why LS has such a huge lead, that he is the front runner for the next Katri.
Simply saying that he is riding on Harvard brand and talks well is not enough – its same like accusing Tethong as Kudrak and out of touch with masses.
Things might be more complex.
Unfortunately, we tend to become victims of self-righteousness, think that our candidate is the best and thus become blind to the good things in the opposing candidate.
@Nyima-la,
I personally don’t like this ‘sacrifice’ thing. It was Tethong-la’s choice that he decided not to pursue his further academic career and serve in the exile government.
The word sacrifice implies some kind of giving up, being forced to do something against one’s wishes!
Because of this choice, it has been very helpful and beneficial to both the Tibetan people and Tethong himself.
Because of this choice or what u call ‘sacrifice,’ he is an accomplished man, both for himself, as a Stanford employee, and to the Tibetan struggle. It’s interdependent!
Both Tethong and Tibetan people should feel grateful to each other!
There will not be much of a difference between preli and final vote result.
I would not waste time trying to convince people otherwise. The right Candidate or otherwise known as Young,energetic,selfless,yarap,namchoe sangpo,visionary,hard working,inspirational,and zikpo is the chosen one.
kee hee hee hee!!
initially the prelim result was discouraging(not shocking) with almost 50% margin betwen the 2 top candidates but on letting my thought mechanism loose on the result the second time, 12000 votes for tetong is infact very encouraging given the fact he hardly campaigned! if rumors are to be believed, tetong is awakened! and has vowed to campaign strategically in shichaks for his tibet vision and strike hard where it hurts most, lobsang’s pair!
very energising indeed!
60,000 will vote n if HH stresses voter participation just one time at tsulakhang, at least 100,000 will vote if not all 120,000.
campaigning in 20 main shichaks with 8 supporters in a van and flight cost no more than 60 days and ic15 lacs. this much tetong alone can come up easily having lived and worked in ari for 15 years now. i as a supporter will do my best to win 2000 votes for him.
lobsang’s claim that he went to ari for tibet cause is an out right lie. dishonesty at its height! there is nothing wrong in him or any one going to ari for a better life. we all do that.
if i were to give a percentage it would be 90%self, 10% cause with him. would he accept if he were sent to kerala university to do his phd? hell no! besides booksmart, streetsmart, where is the integrity? his credibility at stake on this point alone! i for one canot entrust the future of tibet in the hands of a double dealer political novice who will recruit 7 more yes sir bachas as kalons! PERIOD!
it may be very ”temdrel sangpo” to daveno, but let’s see who will cry the last cry
ki he he!
tenpa gapshi, it is encouraging to see a future jn in you! keep going young man!
The primary election results have come and all of us are munching on it. As to the Katri results, LS and Tethong are at the fore to fight it out on their own merits. LS supporters are all smiles in their joy at their icon’s strong showing, and Tethong supporters are doing their best to turn the table on the opponent of their candidate in the general election.
No doubt Tethong is a dour figure with a serious demeanor befitting his aristocratic roots. People find him haughty and unapproachable in this age of equality. On top of that, the Ladhak incident during his tenure as the Katri (unelected by universal suffrage) is a millstone around his neck, so many Tibetans find it difficult to opt for him. Be it true or not, there is a perception among the people that Tethong was mired in shady dealings during his long stint in the Tibetan establishment. If Tethong wants to overturn the table on LS in the general elections, it is imperative for him to lay to rest all these allusions and innuendoes which are rife against him in the Tibetan Diaspora. Else, LS, an inexperienced, untried, unknown, un, un, un, un and un would rule the roost in the TGIE for the next five years.
In this bizarre scenario of LS as the Katri, we would be inculcated to follow his vision of national integration of the Tibetans into the Chinese mainstream. Six million (?) into a mass of thirteen billion. Besides his ambition of being the Chinese Obama, the six million grasshoppers would get lost in the sheer mass of the swarm of thirteen billion locusts. The alpha male of the grasshoppers, instead of being the leader of the locust swarm would be the first meal of the voracious mass.
Appropos. Read ‘1.3’ for ‘thirteen’ billion in my post. Now and then we get carried out by our enthusiasm for the topic in discussion. A faux pas all the same.
I totally agree with Wangchuk,
If Tethong is able to come clear on these shady deals and able to clear up his name in a transparent way- he would beat LS. The fact is positive achievements cant only be the criteria for a leader. We have to be convinced he is not corrupt.Its easy for JN to dismiss these allegations, but one has to come up with facts and figures!! Smoke without fire? I dooubt it!!
In the end, tn will win by a small margin. If you look at the primary result more carefully, it is not a huge gap between those who want change vs someone with the years of service. As more voters learn more about tn and ls, I see more voters changing their votes. After all, katri post is too important to take a chance and see what happens.
Great job on the article, Tenpa.
For those who cannot stand the result of the preli vote,there is no use increasing your volume,its noisy and makes not much sense repeating the same old logic.
Nothing will change!PERIOD.!
Gyakap rangzen will still remain a gyakap rangzen with a possibility for turning into a basement rangzen.
It is just another repeatability and I don’t find any balance in this article.
daveno, 4 more months to go. we shall see who ends up in basement or trump tower. tetong forces are on the move! watch out!
Gyakyap rangzen,
I don’t have to wait to see the end.I saw the end with my leader not in a basement or trump but in a humble ghankyi staff quota.
you guys are great! Were you planning to release your ‘one penny’ army all over?
Good luck! You need luck to win!
for those with eye sight issues i highly recommend a pair of powered glasses to see the beginning of the end for the dream merchant of havard! luck pales before facts demanding courage to admit facts! credibility? !
A prime qualification for a leader is charisma, vision, intellect, integrity & ability to inspire which LS has in plenty. Age & experience are important qualifications though but not nearly as important. No matter how hard Tethong la engages in campaigning from now on, the battle is already won by LS. Good Luck !!!
i have one question for Lobsang Sangay’s supporters. Who does he look upto as his his role model? That would say a lot about him. yes, he has charisma and ability to inspire some people but are you sure he has integrity?
most of those who voted for gyari, jinpa and tashi wangdi will vote for older experienced tetong. thats 7000+12000=19000 prety close to lobsang’s!
Hey HTGT,
you said, “I hope to see Tethong la writing on aspects of Tibetan political struggle one day! Comparison between the two in this field, I think, will help us better in ‘judging’ LS’s writings/academic scholarship.”
Judging Academic Scholarship?
Why? Are we looking for somebody to fill a professor post?
I thought i have enlighten you earlier, but obviously i am wrong. You may be Phenpowa! haha.
On a serious note, if you really think academic scholarship as the main criteria for getting the Katri seat, then LS is probably the last person to fill that post. Because, he produces a very poor quality writings even after studying for over 33 + years (to be precise, 18 years in India and 15 years in US)
Tethong la has only “12 years” of classroom education, but his writing is more superior, his ideas more authentic and innovative, and his language far better and smoother.
Since LS is academician, lets compare his writing to other academician. If he is poorer or not in par with Dawa Norbu la, then he shouldn’t flaunt his phd. degree. After all, he is not the first person to get phd. Besides, he is not the first person to get phd from Harvard. And don’t think that you are as good as Obama bacause you happen to be graduate from same university. We have a Tibetan saying, “Bhu Dhang BHu dra na Gyalpo Sue jeki re? (If two sons of the same family are same, then who will become the next king?)
HTGT,
We could have gotten the chance to judge not only their writings but their ideas and vision if LS chose to answer the questions that was put forth by TPR well in advance. They have decided to publish all the Katri candidates answers on the same day without any editing. Even after extending the dateline, None except tethong la was able to provide the answers. On the other hand, Tethong la answers were mature and just told us that he is ready to lead. He has those ideas in his head and ready to deal with it.
LS inability to answers TPR question tells us so much. First, it is very clear that he had no work ethics-can’t finish his work on time and that too after extension of dateline.
Secondly, he is not ready to lead as those questions are too tough to answers and he has to counsel with his groups for ideas and corrections for his language.
In short, i present to you snippet of his writing. You judge how great your candidate (LS) writings are. LS response to Jamyang norbu’s article:
“I found Jamyang las analysis to be way off mark. The statement I want to be Obama of China, was a JOKE and not meant to be taken seriously.”
On a mission to enlighten the fooled public.
Agu-Tonpa.
Remember guys,
Lobsang Sangye is a kudrak of Tibetan in exile. He had connection and support of Lithang Athar, has Gyalo thondup and other divisive and thuggish people and the monastic community.
As a fullbright sholarship WAITLISTED candidate and later as he became the last one on the list, he got a preferential treatment and admitted (through his connection of Dr. Tenzin Choedrak) to Harvard. Dr. Tenzin Choedrak, as all of us know, is the most sectarian and regionalist person one could ever meet. If you say you are Khampa, you’ll get better treatment, and if you say you are Markham, then he will lick you. Such is the person. Ask the fullbright Scholar if you think i am a liar and sectarian like Dr. Tenzin Choedrak.
If ALL KUDRAK are Bad, then HHDL won’t be alive today, if at all they were able to recognize a real one. So, like not all khampas are taiwan phogsen, not all kudrak are bad.
YOurs Agu,
On a mission to enlightened the fooled public.
Lobsang Sangye la should thank Tethong la for he is the one who started the Tibet fund and through which he got scholarship. Without Tethong’s visionary leadership, LS may still be eating Tingmo and Dali.
Off course, looking at Agu Tenpa’s writing, he should thank many people.
Kushok OOri
Aku Tonpa,
I am not from Phenpo, but the phenpo restaurant in Gankyi used to be quite popular. It appears they are great cooks.
I’m not saying academic scholarship is the main criteria for PM’s post. I was trying to ‘enlighten some of LS detractors who fail to appreciate his decent knowledge of Tibetan politics thanks to his many years of study at Harvard.
If academic scholarship is the ultimate criteria for PM’s post, then I would have requested Tsering Shakya or even Jnorbu to run for our PM’s post.
But we can’t deny the fact that academic knowledge or a decent understanding of Tibetan political struggle is a great asset for any political leader.
I was forced to say that I wanted to compare LS’s writings with Tethong’s because some of the latter’s supporters are also making a big deal of his work at Stanford. They even called him a ‘Tibetologist.’ That’s why I wanted to read his writings, so that I can fairly understand his views, visions and insight about our struggle.
There’s no doubt Tethong is a decent and modest man, but I would love to see a new leadership, with fresh approach and different working style.
Tethong-la’s approach and style of working is something I have been living with for ages now.
Seriously, it doesn’t motivate me much!
And yes Apohas, including the legendary Aku Tonpa, were great entertainers, but not visionaries.
So, I am not very hopeful of your mission to ‘enlighten people.’
Guys, this is so funny.
Recently i heard that during LS’s visit to shechak(south), he visited(takor) to the farm field and measured length by his eyes. the farmers anticipatively placate him. finally, on some farmers request LS promised to provide them tractors. haha…
when he is goin to stop this?
It is such a pleasure to read all these views and opinions that say so much about a wide subject ranging from Kudaks to the farmers. Sure, through reading the articles in the Tibetan and English medium News and websites of Tibetans, I think it is Tibetans’ habit that point out the bad things of others first and foremost. But I hope and wish for the civilized Tibetans to point out good ways ahead for further development of our Culture, people, civilization, unity,democracy etc.
Tibet was ruled by Kudraks for centuries. Why we lost our country is all well known to everybody. Why many of the Dalai Lama’s died in their young age? Why majority of the common Tibetans were illiterate?
Kudraks were picnicking while commoners were trying to fight the Chinese invasion.
The way the commoners were kept as slaves, illiterate and underdeveloped was all due to the ill-designs of Kudraks.
TNT may not have anything to do with what happened in old Tibet as he might have been an early teenager at the time of Chinese occupation.
The question now is that why some people (does non-Kudraks who voted for TNT) don’t understand the need for change in the course of history of Tibet.
I personally do not have any ill feeling towards TNT as he has done so much for the Tibet and Tibetans.
If I may, he had done do much during the difficult times of the exile life of the Tibetans. Now it’s time to say thank you and let the younger generation take charge. It’s not that the younger generation is not capable. They are coming up to say we can and we will and we are ready!
If there are non-Kudraks TNT Stooges, I would like to tell them to change and vote for LS to be a part of an important history and victory.
I secretly feel that most of the comments in this blog are coming from members of the Kudrak clan. If that is the case, I know they will not change and surely will not consider my suggestion.
Vote for Lobsang Sangay for a new Tibet!
The article in question is great if you support Kasur Tenzing Tethong,but to say it’s balanced is akin to Fox News being the same ‘fair & balanced’.
We are not voting for the person with the most experience nor are we voting for the person with the best education background.
Charisma has always been the key ingredient in a powerful leader and at this moment in our time we may just have that opportunity.
The future will tell us if it was a blessing or a curse.
When i read ” OUR VERY OWN Tenpa has written”.
It is very divisive in approach and certainly says there is a club of sort to be “VERY OWN”.
Those who bring the factor of kudraks into this disucssion, please wake up, you are talking about pre-1959 society. In our history, there are good things and bad things, we can’t blame everything on kudraks. After 1959, everyone is in the same boat. We are now talking about 2011 elections. We must move forward with openness and accountability. We are now 21st century Tibetans. Just look at the service record of TNT for the last 40 years in our exile society. It speaks for itself. Just having a Phd degree and able to give big talk in public and having organized some conference between handful of scholars is not enough to lead us. LS claims his last 15 years in Boston is for our sake is ridiculous and matter of the fact is for his own sake only. Talking about unity, he is one the most divisive person that one can find in Tibetan society. Just think how he has campaigned in South Indian monasteries. Just analyse his talk and his campaign in South India. It speaks for itself.
I applaud his degree. He must have worked really hard. He should be proud of himself. However,
what he has achieved is his own personal achievement and he cannot make this as a right to hold the highest post in our exile govt. Because he is not the most deserving candidate and he does not have the credential to become our next Kalon Tripa. We know he has a huge lead because of monasteries from South India but I ask our all our reverend monks if they truly study Buddhism, then they should try to find the truth about their candidate’s true credential and then judge with their wisdom and I am sure they will find the answer. Compare TNT 40 years of service with proven track record of accomplishment and with LS no service record with havard degree and only talk. He is no Obama. Obama became leader because of his own credential and record of service and not based on Havard University.
Thanks Tsering Topgyal, one of the few enlightened people I read here….!
For the times are changing!
In the lexicon of our very own Lobsang Sangayspeak, tibetans in the west are here for the cause of Tibet.I convinced myself of tht now. What a genius he is. times are changing and so daveno plese count me in. i join the bandwgon too in the hope that some of the delusions of grndeur rub off on me too.
I often hear/read that LS stands for change. But no one seem to tell what changes he/ she is talking about. Does LS has any plan on what will be his first order of things to do if he is elected? Please give me one example. I think it will be irresponsible to vote for him or for that matter any candidate without knowing what his/her plan is. Personally, I have the following list to suggest:
1. Introduction of party system
2. Separation of church and state
3. Seek observer status at UN. (at least)
4. Reformation of schools/education system
5. Ban on binding kids to monastic vows
6. Promotion and secularization of our language
Needless to say innovative campaigns against Chinese govt.
So many senseless talks and overreactions!!! Lobsang Sangay may have a Harvard degree but what else? Is our Kalon Tripa a competition of who has the highest degree or a real person who can handle the job on the ground with thorough knowledge of the Tibetan govt in exile and its functioning? At this very critical juncture of our history, we don’t at all need a person who only has a PhD and nothing else. I am having bouts of sleeplessness when I think of LS becoming our Kalon Tripa. I am sure that he can do nothing if he becomes the Kalon Tripa except putting his own people to various important Tibetan administrative posts.
If you the Lobsnag Sangay supporters are so much about youth and change (considering for a minute this is valid) I would suggest you to vote for Gyari Dolma but please do not vote or think of LS becoming a KT. Gyari Dolma has experience of working for years at the helm of Tibetan govt. and also a very able lady for that. So, guys, forget LS for Buddha’s sake and save our people and our govt.
Moreover, LS still has not answered many questions on this blog by many readers about his visit to Beijing twice on IC and his unlimited campaign funds. If you are a real and devout Tibetan thinking for the future of Tibet, please ask these questions to your candidate LS and get answers for yourself and also for us. We cannot blindly vote LS and leave the bigger issues behind him unscrutinized. I smelling fish all around LS. He has few years ago declined to be Dotoe Chithue saying that his work and the so called research at Harvard is more helpful than working at Dharamsala. If that is so, then why not continue to work at Harvard for Tibet. These days he is running like a crazy horse to become the Kalon Tripa and my question is why? I am just hopeful and praying day and night for LS not to strike any deal with our enemy and sell my beloved country.
Please don’t sell my country or else I will not stop crying…!!!
who is this dr tenzin chodak? personal herbal physician of HH or that modern medicine doc from byllakupee who is in dhasa?
Many of the people here have been talking about finding the true credentials(TRUTH)of the KT nominees. But how will the people find the truth and who will provide them the truth? Everyone seems to be in the one or other group.
A brainless brat has written somewhere that ‘ ls got fullbright scholarship thanks to TN who initiated the program’ for which LS whould be thankful.
IT’s not TN person who took initiative about all those ICT, 1000 tibetan US immigration,etc, but he’s, in fact, a sort of secratary, or helper to the missions of HH the dalai lama. He’s kudrak and he’s close to his holiness in those 1970s. No common man can get into strong official circles because there’s no educated man from common backgroud due to pre-1959 tibet society of educating only the aristocrats.
Those aristocrats who shifted to India used Tibet Cause to further their business links abroad. Along the side, it helped nation, but main motive was their own career success. secondly, aristocrats were highly disgraced in exile for their bullying ways in olden tibet,which no longer applied in foreign india. all men were equel there. So they did something for the people, which of course, they should do, to earn some respect, credibility which they always longed for.
if aristocrats educated tibetan common people, if tib government gave equel opportunities, hunred of common people have contributed to the nation during the time of dire need in 1960s onward. nobles like JN and TN did alot…but was there anyone from poor background who did anything for the nation? No. They don’t have the facility to study. LS’s father would have done as much as TN had the former received opportunities like TN.
My point regarding TNT as a Kudrak off-shoot was not meant to take it at individual level. It was point related to a trend — Kudrak ringlug (Kudrak’s rule) — for many centuries.
We need to change that trend by bringing in a commoner. This is what I mean by an important moment in the history of Tibet.
Two, TNT had served TGiE for many years. If experience, integrity and visionary you are talking about, they Tashi Wangdi la would be better than TNT. Then why not campaign for him
Let’s say TNT is given five years, although we all know that chances are almost impossible unless all Tibetans go mad, we will be wasting five crucial years. Dalai Lama will be five years older and the younger generation leaders like LS will miss five years of chance to catch up and build the bridge between the past and the future.
Therefore, experience is not really a criterion to become a Kalon Tripa. TNT has become an experienced person only after working/serving for many years. Give LS the same opportunity and when he will be by TNT’s age, he will also become and experienced person. So, it’s not the experience that’s crucial at all. It would definitely a good level of education, visions, talent, enthusiasm, vigour, personality and public mandate that makes a good leader. LS has all these qualities. He certainly will achieve many things like TNT, if not more.
So, pardon me for my bad Chinese: Old donkeys get out of the way for the young energetic fellow.
As some one has suggested, I haven’t heard of a Lobsang Sangay camp at all. I as a supporter of LS, am doing so at my personal capacity. I have been mostly using the chat forums, some phone calls and speaking up when I meet friends and strangers who are interested.
Now I see some people raising funds for TNT. Why he was not able to make some money in the last almost 20 years after leaving an unfinished kalon tripa term to the US? I heard that LS is drawing good salary at Harvard that allows him to travel to and fro to India a few times more than an average Tibetan wage earner like TNT.
I saw students of Sarah, Mentseekhang and Norbulingka openly campaigning for LS with their own money. I saw a huge banner they produced bearing a big photo of LS in front of Tsuglakhang in Mcleod Ganj.
I also saw his campaign posters in Dharamshala and Delhi sponsored by a guy from Santa Fe. So, it’s no point in trying to bring issues like this.
His China travel, if his supporters have no problem, it’s not important to reply this issue raised in this blog — supporting for TNT.
Many Tibetan scholars from India have travelled to China over the years for conferences. If you have any scholar friends, ask them how did they go. It’s as simple as that.
And there is no such thing as he will cut a deal. This is ridiculous. All the major issues will be defined by the chitues (parliament). Even the budgets will be set by them. Please don’t do like the silly rabbit worrying about the sky’s being falling.
Wake up fellow countrymen.
Vote for Lobsang Sangay!
Vote for change!
Vote for a new Tibet!
do we have a single article of that oldie called Tethong? Judging by his debates, he’s seems bit world-weary, exhausted, with a waning sharpness of mind, which results in vague answers, certain undecisiveness in his own words…and there’s that strong air of ” guilty consciousness” in his eyes, which he tries hard to conceal. He even stammers from time to time, which is a sign of problems at sub-conscious level, mainly fears, doubts,confusions,resentment. His mental health should be checked! well, since he doesn’t score well in verbal terms, we might give him a chance through his writings.
LS has strong personality, quick mind, charisma, decisiveness( very important qualification,even at wrong decisions at times), humility, openness, adaptibility. TN is the exact opposite. TN is trying to preserve the old vestiges of aristocratic “elegence”( which includes walking and talking slowly, showing a detached persona, demonstrating “there-are-things-you-small-men-won’t-understand” way of conversing by just giving value, outline kind of answers to questions, keeping away from masses, maintaining a reserve persona( by neither highlighting achievements nor acknowleding short-comings),avoiding strong physical or verbal exertions( to show royal composure, a deliberate hint of comfortable living standard).
I was appaled by JN&his hooligans’ interpretation of that TN’s highly offensive, out-of-date mentality of royal prestige, as signs of honesty,decency and pragmatism. Those riding in JN-bandwagon should buy a copy of ” Introduction to Human Anthropology” at the next stop,for studying basics of human anthropology which explains the behavior of human beings. Political analysis is more complex than mathamatical reasoning…it involves psychology,anthropoloy,history,and other areas of learning which you are terrible novices.
Don’t jump on crude, hasty conclusion. Subtlity is the game of this century.
LAST time, tethong left for USA, ditching his office and Tibetan nation, to earn cash for his children’s EDUCATION. Why does he have to send his children to USA for studies while thousands of Tibetan refugees children study in TCV Schools? Even Ama Jetsun Pema’s children attended TCV Schools, ate yellow tingmo and watery dal, and accepted spanking from homemothers. Does he think his children are above other Tibetan children? i heard this from youtube video,and left a bad impression in my mind.
THIS time,say he got katri, who can guarantee he won’t betray Tibet once again for USA to raise fund for his children’s MARRIAGE. He would need money for marriage, as was needed for education. we can draw predict his future from his past record of treachery.
And what about his case of corruption? He, or even JN, didn’t provide any concrete prove to clear his dark name. Partisan tethong campaigners are excessively highlighting his experience to hide his corruption case.
Seriously, we should be careful before we pick up a dangerous man into the highest position of exile government.
Thanks Jamyang la for posting this on your blog and appreciate all the posts irregardless of whether it made sense or it just came out of the shallow end of the human gene pool.
Old Monk: you still at it? On one hand, you make it seem like the kalon Tripa post is extremely important but at the same time, anything that is achieved by under Tethong’s supervision is attributed to H.H. Secretarial post? Isn’t that what you called it? Then why not appoint a good secretary from Gankyi instead of a Harvard Law graduate? It would be such a waste of talent. He would be doing the exact same thing, I presume. It could very well be that Tethong was in a good position to help TGIE and the exile Tibetans but that doesn’t diminish the fact that he ACTUALLY did help our community tremendously. If all men are equal, as you say, then why are you bringing his family background in the mix? Why not just judge him, his service, his accomplishments? While you are at it blaming the Kudraks, why are you not blaming the monastic community who held the other half of the power metrics in Tibet? Oh, I forgot, you are a monk. Nevermind.
@Tashi Dhondup: Does change only mean change of generation? Is that only criteria you look at when choosing somebody to run your country at such a critical time? What change is LS promising? Where is his mandate? We know what Tethong is capable of and he has proven it again and again throughout the years. Lets at least have LS spell it out what changes he wants to bring to an institution he never took part in. Experience, nah, zero experience might not be such a big deal if you are looking at an entry level job in a company, but if you are shooting for the President of the company post, then no company on earth, hell, or heaven will select someone without any experience in the industry. You try it. Go ahead. I can wait.
If you want us to give LS the same opportunity as Tethong la, by all means, we will welcome him at the parliament as a member of the North America representative or as a specialist(that might be stretching it too) in the sino-Tibetan relations. Unless of course he will feels it is beneath him. Tethong didn’t become Kalon Tripa overnight and neither did Obama (president). They started at a much lower post and worked their way up. LS thinking that he can run a country’s future without any mileage could very well border on arrogance while his supporters believing he actually could, might also howl at the moon in their spare time. I am astonished how your logic works and quite fearful for our future. Didn’t you guys read the news that Kundun is comtemplating total retirement? Do you want full power vested in a political novice? What if kundun passes away in the next 5 years? that is what foresight means, thinking about all angles and all possibilities and dangers that might brings our community and our bretherns in Tibet.
Thank you Oldmonk la,HTGT,TD,TT..very good points.
A COMEDY OF ERRORS.
Agu Tonpa is back again on his mission of ‘SPIN talk’.
I should mention here that the first few times Agu Tonpa rattled off I mistook him for someone else altogether. That person happened to be one of the ‘instigators’ @ the time and sometime later he ended up becoming a relative of a brother of Tenzing Namgyala. It made sense to me then that he was very apologetic; wanting to make amends and confessions!!!
All that matters is that I was completely wrong about him. I don’t think that person even bothers to go online.
No matter how well educated and world wise a person is if he or she stoops down to tribalism everything one starts to say logically ends up as invectives against the opponent. Because when discussing the needs of a nation, tribalism turns otherwise reasonable person into ranting fanatics. So, if one really cares for Tibet one should strive to be hingh minded, inside.
Gyakhab Rangzen,
Dr Tenzing Chodak is not a medical doctor.
He is an academic.
I have never heard of him being so biased; but then that is Agu Tonpa’s spin.
To me, Aku Tonpa and Old monk seems to be the two sides of the same coin!
Great insights Bhumo Zema. You are really beautiful!
It is unfair to discount Tenpa Gapshi’s writeup just because he favors a particular candidate. In it he argues well and without venom which is what a good citizen is about. Incidentally I also happen to be a supporter of TN Tethong.
If I support Tethong it is not because I am for aristocrats. (Infact I get turned off by their attraction to all things Chinese and their tendency to use Chinese words with Lhasa accents. Oh it rankles me.) It is neither because I am one of Jamyang Norbu’s “hooligans” as someone mentions. I am too old and sedate to be anybody’s hooligan. But I am proud to say that I admire Jamyang Norbu’s writings and his loyalty for Tibet.
The reasons of TN’s suitability for the PM’s position are manifold. He has proven record of service to our people. He has also started many institutions in the west to serve Tibetans. It is unjust to blame him for not running for public office when he felt he needed to put his family affairs in order. No man should be blamed for trying to save his children from becoming no good and parasites to society. What is laudable is he chose to come back to serve when he has the abilty to. I heard him in New York a year or so ago. He is intelligent,well informed, down to earth but also direct and funny too. I remember he didn’t appreciate the fact that the meeting was set for 10am but people actually began to trickle in after 11am. Funny is not a requirement but it helps.
Beware of people who bring up the strawman issue of Kudrak Vs. Commoner. Kudrak people were equally divided amongst accomodationists and nationalists in the years before we lost our country. It was the nationalist Kudraks who rallied the people to Norbu Linka on March 10, 1959. The Lamas and their monasteries decided to side with the patriots only when they discovered that the Chinese were dead set against religion. Most of them still decided to stay behind. An objective reading of our history will reveal that the religious establishments were the biggest obstacle to modernization and reformation of our society, which left us ill prepared in face of crisis.
Baba Phuntsok Wangyal could be called a Commoner and we all know what he did. And I don’t know the names but I can bet there were commoners who spat on Panchen Rinpoche during Thamzing not just out of fear of the Commy Thugs but to please them in hope of getting rewards.
We will always have divisions no matter who is the ruling group. But I can bet these divisions will be more toxic and irreperable if they are religiuos or tribal.
The only question now is can we be rational, practical, realistic, objective and honest.
I am not of Kudrak breed, far from it. I am a commoner and will remain a commoner the rest of my life. I also used to hate Kudraks when I was younger and I still think people’s grievances were real against that class. But today it is not important. Time and People have changed. It is pointless to raise this issue these days.
LS says he doesn’t like it that Umey Lham proponents and Rangzen proponents both use “excessive rhetoric”…which he finds “unhealthy and divisive”.
His Holiness or TGIE led by Samdhong Rinpoche are the proponent of Umey lham; Jamyang Norbu and his supporters are the proponents of Rangzen.
Lobsang Sangay, tell us what did His Holiness/Samdhong Rinpoche say or Jamyang Norbu say with regard to our political struggle that you found “excessive” and were “divisive and unhealthy”?
i am trying to win 1,000 votes for LS. Hope other insightful LS supporters are doing the best in their capacity to get the real man of wisdom and morality win the katri seat. his holiness is ageing, and we need a real, pragmatic leader.
he shouldn’t be corrupt, like TN.
he shouldn’t be indolent, like TN.
he shouldn’t be old, like TN.
he shouldn’t be deserter, like TN.
he shouldn’t be high-school graduate, like TN.
he shouldn’t be aristocrat, like TN.
let’s promote kasur Tashi Wangdue to devide his TN’s vote. tashi wangdue has similar backgrounds as TN in many regards, so it’s a very good chance to compare them, and transfer few hundreds of TN’s vote to TW. Let’s also promote everyone of the six katri contestants to maintain the status quo of LS’s lead in the polls.
i heard TN is just a fellow in Stanford without any real responsibility. He does something like basic Tibetan language( ka ca gha nga, “shamo” for hat, “nyima” for sun…sort of basics) teaching for inquisitive westerners, the post of which is created to boost Standford’s reputation of having people from numerous, remote ethnicities in its campus for one thing, and to show a goodwill gesture to his holiness. There’re plenty of other Tibetans affiliated to prestigious university, including late Dalai Lama’s brother, Lhamo kyab( Paris University),etc, whose roles are merely symbolic. That’s a very neo-western way of advertising their universities.
TN’s association with Stanford has nothing to do with his academic credentials. LS is totally in a different league. He’s a senior research fellow at Harvard, the post he EARNED, rather than AWARDED( in Tethong’s case) through his struggles. TN came up this far, without particular talents, through a legion of opportunities due to his previledged family backgrounds.
TN’s credentials are overblown by zealot elitists desperate to retain a status quo government. And just the fact that JN is supporting TN is a curse in disguise, given the way JN’s views are deemed extremist and subversive in the mainstream Tibetan official and non-official circles, in addition to their shared aristocratic roots and their cousin-hood, which JN publicized unwittingly during his hullicination.
let’s wait and watch, guys.
@daveno, @lajotsang, @namgyal kyulo, @old monk, @not so wiseman,@Bdheychen, @HTGT, @TT, @TD, you guys please read carefully and answer these questions on behalf of your candidate Lobsang Sangay:
1. How did Lobsnag Sangay go to Beijing with an IC and meet the high level officials of communist govt? No one in the exile Tibetan community has ever been issued a Chinese visa on Indian IC. Why is this preferential treatment to LS by the Chinese communist govt. I am and so are many curious about this.
2. What is the source of LS’ unlimited campaign fund (are you sure no other crooked nation is sponsoring him) it may be a little too much for some in this blog to call him Gyami Sowa but he better explain and clear the suspicions in people’s mind.
3. LS broke the law by not returning after completion of his Fulbright program. How does he justify this.
4. Inspite of staying in the US for so long, how does he still carry a valid IC issued by the Indian govt. I think the Indian and the US govt. must also make sure any law is not broken.
5. Did he pay his green book properly? When did he start paying as an employed Tibetan (which year) and does that year correspond to his employment date? We must check.
We need a Kalon Tripa who respects laws of the land and an honest person who can draw respect and trust from all quarters.
More serious questions later!!!
Sharu chigpa or nyinpa,
The questions you asked were all answered by fellow supporter of the true leader LS la before the Preli result was out.
I dont blame you, we all have the ‘Gyaghar phagpay yuil jee ghomshee sangpo’ of arriving late all the time.
Go to kalontripafortibet.com and vote for LS la.
Kalsang Phuntsok #45.
A check on the growing corruption in certain religious circles in the ‘crowning’ of a new reincarnate Rinpoche or Tulku. Please add that as an addendum to the point#5.
There are the true ‘genuine’ & ‘authentic’ ones. But the current environment attracts scoundrels seeking power & prestige.
Bdheychen, of course, add by all means. The sad truth is that religion always interferes in secular affairs but can’t tolerate enlightened ideas coming from secular sources. It always wants to be the dictator of ideas but not necessarily an inventor of one and always resists reformation by it’s very nature.
If you look at them carefully religious organizations operates very much like business corporations.
If one is to really contemplate the necessity of these organizations, one has to ask the question if these organization can even survive without the material support of the lay masses who indulge in the materialism which they always teach against. The answer is obviously no. In fact they themselves have become the very embodiment of the materiallism they speak so lowly of, all the while never ceasing to inflict guilt feeling in the common masses for being materialistic.
wtf, is tribalism the new f word.
If this is the level of discourse maybe we all deserve to live under the Chinese.
@Devano,
I went to LS’s site and it sent me to a link at NDPT where I found nothing except some scrapy news. Can you please check yourself and send me a real link and not a phony one to fool all. Or else go and vote for Gyari Dolma who is 1 1000 times more appropriate person to lead us than LS with zero experience except his Harvard degree.
Khampa Tsang: your comment promotes despicable provincialism and as such won’t be published. Golok Ambum, Webmaster.
Since when did fending off the bashings and ranting & raving of a so called Agu Tonpa become ‘tribalism’.
I guess it is okay in your judgement to do the attacking but not the defending.
He has been given ample opportunites to liberally bash certain people who seem to have no representation here.
Please put an end to your covert advocating of bashing of certain people; that is definitely ‘tribalism’.
you guys are missing the point here. Lobsang Sangay is the ambitious, pompous apho-hor boy that
every one from juchen to gyalo loves to pet.
juchen wants him to promote khampa power, gyalo wants him to promote anti-kudrag movement he started since the death of his father and CIA days.
Actually, the kudrag ringlug as it pertains to U-pas in power has ended long time back. Most renowned are phala dronchen, sisur lhukhangwa.
Thoses were nationalists. Others joined the administration in india. in the SFF army, gyalo effectively replaced the dapons with khampas.
So it has been a struggle since then. Gyalo’s agenda is to safeguard the interest of yabshi family who effectively controls the tibetans in exile.
As a pretext to change Tibetan society from kudrags, he became victim of his own game. He is now a kudrag with a notorious gangster reputation since the murder of gungthang tsultrim.
So lobsang sangay is a better choice for yabshi as a trophy for their supposed democracy move.
Otherwise, tethong is problematic. they are powerful clan from kham (new aristocrats) thanks to gyalo, who competes with yabshi !
So guys, gulp down some brandy and sleep tight.
I keep hearing about campaign funding in here and in TPR by those legal rats.
How much would it cost to go to india and live, eat, stay with relatives and friends.
The airfare is 1.5G and other travelling cost is very bery cheap.You dont need a spending account with few Mil. for India.5K is enough.
And we all know that our work can be performed through virtual office or satellite office,so do some multi-tasking,its healthy.
@DAVENO:
You showed your ignorance and bias when you said “I keep hearing about campaign funding in here and in TPR by those legal rats.”
As of today, November 22, 2010, TPR has NEVER — I repeat NEVER — talked about campaign funding for Lobsang Sangay or for any other candidate.
Go try to find it and post it here to prove me wrong. You can’t. You don’t know what you’re talking about.
Lhakpa you are quite right. LS seems like the golden boy who everybody want to be with. From gyalo to gyari to juchen. These three personalities all operate quite differently but eventually all about seeking power. I hope that whoever becomes Kalon Tripa will try to steer away from these people. otherwise things become even more convulated and directionless.
BDeycheyn,
I said I support TNT, not being covert here. But I have problem with either side being vitriolic. I don’t enjoy when people start personal attacks. But if you insist go ahead and make the chinese guffaw, snicker, chortle, whatever. make their day.
Pasang #76 – You hit the nail on the head. I couldn’t agree with you more.
We don’t have a party system; with differing ideologies and paths – not yet.
When the time comes for election – it’s really all about the candidate.
(I don’t see any clear cut policies from either candidates).
LS definitely does NOT appear to be the ‘under dog’ if he’s got the support – top to bottom.
While LS seems to have all the makings of a Silon candidate – I am just a little nervous about his idea of ‘integration’ & ‘assimilation’. Was that just rhetorical? Wonder by what authority he came up with that bizarre notion
Tribalism,
I think I may have spoken out of context……
HTGT your comment # 17
TNT is a man with integrity and humility, thats why he shares the credit with everyone who worked with him to make those visionary initiatives possible. I havent heard him go around and tell the world or act as if he nobody knows more than him.
Now compare this trait with LS, this guy is all about ME ME ME and ME. He’s the kind of guy who imposes his ‘greatness’ on you, rather than earn it. My friends up in Boston tell me that they are so fed up with his self-congratulatory talk that many of them avoid him. I just wish our Election Commission would annouce the result of prilm. election region-wise, so we would know what those friends of mine say was true, that over 75% of Tibetans in Boston voted against LS!
..opps..please read as ‘more than anyone’ in the first para
Fakedaveno!
Did i mention “campaign funding for Lobsang sangay” or Just ‘Campaign funding”.? Do not assume and make up stuff.
REad the letter by tswang namgyal in TPR that has the touch on funding just an example.
Anyheww, My point is that one does not need hell lot of Benjamin franklin notes to visit and stay in India. (Provided you have friends and relatives who live in India.
Not many have friends and relatives in India,which is why staying out of touch of common people is a bad quality of a leader)
Sangay,
I understand what you are saying. LS appears to be ‘arrogant,’ because he’s assertive, and praises himself often.
But I have also noticed that this behavior of him is just superficial – deep down he’s very modest and accessible.
LS’s tour of india will cost nothing. India is damn cheap. 500 rupees from Delhi to dhasa, ie, just $10. train fares are even cheaper. lodging at relatives, and food and restrants being cheap, it’s not a big fuss after all. most people in US earn around 3,000 dollar per month, which is 150, 000 rupees each month. LS is paid well higher than that.
financial accusations only show lack of basic common sense, mathamatics, and economics of TN hooligans.
jamyangla, HH DLLM is reciting his mantra of retiring from bla bla,,,what is the point of him saying this again and again, is there any one in exile who is forcing him to get out of Daramsala or what,or Chairman Hu jingtao wants HH to be retired, any thought??
Something needs to be said about the Kudraks losing Tibet. First thing first, I say that my forebears belong to the peasantry and my grandfather’s tales of greed and rapacity of the aristrocrats, and especially of the high-highhandedness of their servants and henchmen are beyond our imagination. From a historical point of view, feudalism and all that entails, persisted inside Tibet long after the system gave way to other forms of socio-political structures in other countries.
Modern scholars say that the Tibetan aristocracy was a man Friday of the Buddhist clergy, except during the rule of Polhanas from 1728 to 1750. Miwang Polha defeated his political rivals from Ue and accepted Manchu overlordship to rule Tibet. Miwang himself was a devout Buddhist, a student of Lochen Dharmashri of Mindroling, and may have been averse to the dominance of the Gelungpas in Tibetan affairs of the time.
Our forefathers, as devout Buddhists may have had a double standard in looking at their tax collectors. As we all know, most farming villages were bound to monastic institutions, the aristocratic families and the government in Lhasa and its local administrative units. Thus the Chinese talked so much in the fifties and sixties of the last century about the Tibetan serfs being liberated from the yoke of the NGADAK RIWO SUM, three mountains of subjugation. Monastic tax collectors would be looked upon as people working for the sustenance of the Sangha, a part of the Triratna, in spite of the greed and rapacity of those who were supposed to represent the nowhere-to-be-seen impersonal Sangha. As to the gentry and the government contractors (it’s a fact that many or most of government tax collection was done on contract basis), peasants doing subsistence farming in a hostile environment came to look upon them as predators come upon to wrest the fruits of their year long hard labor.
Kudraks were a remnant of a ruling class from a definite socio-political structure Tibet happened to have way into the twentieth century, thanks to its geographical remoteness and Manchu/Ching-Gelugpa priest-patron relationship.
It would be a gross generalization to say that the Kudraks lost Tibet or they impeded Tibet from joining the modern world when it had the chance during the last years of the reign of the Great Thirteenth.
the annals of exile life abound with Tetong’s selfless contributions to our people. To badger him on the deficit story or age factor will ultimately, to say the least, yield no extra votes for LS for the Tibetan people ARE GROWING WEARY of being automatons controlled by the rhetoric of a novice screaming on a Harvard hill top. Lack of intellectual integrity will soon be compounded by a political fall and my prognostication of the exact margin of victory is immaterial while victory for tetong is assured if only he pumps some life into his limbs and start marching to south India first. When voters see this confident looking warrior at their threshold going through the drudgery of canvassing on the dusty roads of shichak will win their hearts instantly so I implore his supporters to flash up this eminent political leader and achiever before the rural folks to alter all the prevailing perceptions! A tinge of some dramatic moves is all that it takes to put an end to the voracious appetite of any inexperienced politicians. And soon enough matrons will line up the streets with milk and khatas to congratulate the interminable tetong!
Fact is 90% of exile Tibetans don’t know who tetong is while only 70% cant tell who LS is.
TETONG—MAKE YOURSELF SEEN AND HEARD!
PLEASE SAY GOODBYE TO TRADITIONAL HUMBLE ALOOF!
3% intellectuals appreciate this style.
97% unlettered folks say no to this outdated style.
You want votes. You decide.
Slow n steady loses the race!
Neck breaking speed n steady wins the katri seat!
Its time for reasonable discussion among us. There is no meaning in indulging divisive and criticism out of bad motivation. Although it is hard to gauge of yours inner motivation, but going by the above line by line discussion, these are completely malicise words. So take your words.
Try your best in preserving ancient moral behaviour of Tibetan tradition in every moment, whether in entering chattin forum, or in going party or everywhere you go. This is our precious jewel, which Dalai Lama always boasts of in every talk he gives in Western countries. So dont try to pull down the Dalai’s name with you.
Our future is at stake!
Tenpa gpshi rightly mentioned our fear on Kundun’s rapid advancing age.
Knowing and considering this dangerous scenario, why should we vote for someone who is also rapidly advancing towards popola designation..wouldn’t that be a double jeopardy?
Its real and we should be practical.
I am feeling very peculiar… as if rationality is melting down in this forum. Why don’t JN openly declare his campaign for his cousin TN? Or, why don’t JN’s coteries, including notorious Tenpa Gapshi and Gyakhab Rangzen( former Mila Rangzen, campaign for their master JN, or at least a fellow who shouts for Rangzen, like Kalsang Phuntsok? Did they change their stance?
we all now are sure about the malicious Trio-ring of JN-GR-TG who are desperate in kicking LS into the deepest hell, and promoting TN to the seventh heaven. JN’s very first opening sentence ” Our very Own Tenpa Gapshi–” clearly show how partisan JN is. who does that ” our” refer to? I never agreed with that tenpa gapshi( or “gaptsar” who indulges in exaggerated idle chatter), and he’s never, ever “mine”.
Why don’t JN himself stand up for katri,( he’s well-qualified for the post), rather than slamming down young, aspiring leaders, like LS?
i agree with daveno. Tethong, being almost as old as His Holiness, won’t be able to take the stressful premiership post,both in psychological and physical terms. He’ll face health problems. And like most family-oriented old man, the welfare of his family, his children ( for whom he once deserted kalon post), besides other worries,etc. will occupy a huge place in his mind,that he won’t be able to focus on TGIE polity.
I believe in tethong being a kalon under LS, probably the head of Home Office and Information and International Relations, areas where he has good experience.( of course, Finance Department should be handled by a more trustworthy, though not necessarily experienced, like Penpa Tsering.)
Tethong’s inarticulate, over-relaxed nature won’t make a competitive politician, which requires dynamism,wit,glibness, and sense of human in the face of today’s political scene. Actually, Tashi Wangdue, will be better than Tethong. They’ve everything similar, experience and education, and all.
In Tethong’s case, I am planning to study, scrutinize Tibetan Charter soon. Hearsays have it that a retired kalon can’t stand up for the same post a second time. I will look up for that provision. We’d respect rules and regulations we made. If we allow such lax practices, then every single person will break rules one by one,” He did that, why not I”, and nothing said by TGIE will have any effect/validity amongst the public.
Regarding the Katri and Chitue discussion, it was more strong, hot and almost tit for tat like that in the Tibetan website like http://www.tibettimes.net and http://www.khabdha.com which are the two highest number of users in exile. I found these two site really good, more like phayul site. So I request you all to go through these two sites. You will not only get uptodate news but also it helps in improving your Tibetan language. Since the most users are Tibet arrival, you will also know the users’s view and thinking side on the exile-grown up Tibetan (SHICHAK) situation. I would be also glad if Jamyang Norbu could try to have translator to his work and put it in those two sites, so that there will be more opinion come up. I think you can have help from Gedun Rabsel or others to translate it. I hope you might have known that It has been a month since some articles of Lobsang Senge was put on tibettimes.net. I dont know who translate those, but atleast it was written by him.
Jamyang la stop being partisan. You support TN on the platforms such as Rangzen Alliance making it seem that he is a rangzen wala. Although he really is your family circle man. Yet you conveniently put down people like KP Godrukpa when he was the president of TYC – a die hard rangzen wala.
I do applaud Tenpa Gapshi for using the english prose and flare for writing in his arsenal being unleashed on this latest political circus of ours. But truly, as someone who remained cut off from the mainstream Tibetan society for at least a decade, his political punditry is novice at best and on things like backstage political maneuvering, I see “our tcv tingmo” tenpa speculating and faltering.
As many have expressed the sentiment all over the tibetan web world – on khabdha and here – that Tashi Wangdi la is far more worthy of the candidature than TN, I too feel the same way.
But as a man of principle and dignity, Tashi la chose not to campaign because of the clause in charter that says Tibetan govt service man should not campaign when they are holding an active service post – Europe rep.
If Tashi la is serious, he should declare his candidature now and resign from his post and do an active campaign.
Old Monk,
You seem to be the most vocal supporter of LS. And I congratulate you that your choice of candidate has won the preliminary voting. I would presume, since you have made your choice very clear, that you know what LS plans to do when he sits on the Kalon Tri. Can you give me one example of what he will do? But feel free to give me more than one. Does he have a list by any chance?
Now don’t answer my question by asking me if TNT has a plan, because first of all that is not an answer; second of all, I don’t necessarily support TNT (but I feel relatively more comfortable with him). So you can count me amongst the undecided. Here’s your chance, convince me to vote for LS.
Old Monk,
Why are you so hung up on ” Our very Own Tenpa Gapshi–” ???
Everybody, let’s cheer up OUR VERY VERY OWN Grumpy poor Old Monk.
One thing LS la will do is not being an ‘untouchable’.
He will serve the tibetan by working closely with them and with his immense respect and understanding of the common tibetan,he will not ditch them in the middle of nowhere.
With this,Kalsang phuntsok la vote for LS.
Old Monk, don’t be jealous. When Jamyang la mentioned ‘our own’ he meant a fellow Rangzen Advocate and nothing else. If it makes you feel any better, he might have called you plain crazy. hahaha….
LS comrades in arm: What CHANGE is LS promising to bring to our exile community? I thought I should ask since he is running on the promise of change. Don’t say change of skin or some outdated concept of class because that would be kind of childish.
I think it is high time to let everyone know that TNT has 3 website to campaign for him.
1.kalontripa2011 by supporter of TNT
2.tibetan political review by supporter of TNT
3.Rangzenalliance by supporter of TNT
Forgot the best fourth one.
jamyangnorbu.com…by TNT supporter.
The job of Kalon Tripa is not like being the president of the TYC, or the head of an NGO, or even that of a Chidue, where the potential to do irreparable damage to Tibetan diplomacy with India, the USA and any number of important nations isn’t there. Unfortunately I really don’t feel that the throngs of unsophisticated monks and the others who think that LS promises ‘change’, whatever that as yet undefined term means, fully grasp the delicate and grave nature of this position. While SR was not able to make much progress in the West’s policies on Tibet (how can he when he hates the West), he was at least able to maintain cordial relations with New Delhi.
If Tibetans appreciate and respect the fact that HHDL has perhaps the most experience than any other living Tibetan in the realm of leadership and political helmsmanship, than how can any Tibetan feel that it’s fine to hand the leadership of the TGIE to a man who doesn’t have any experience in leadership, management and diplomacy?
Is that fair to the Dalai Lama? Is that the best right hand man we can offer to His Holiness? Do you think this is the sort of stupidity he expected when he started to think that democracy might be a good system for Tibet?
Sorry to say, but I don’t feel we are ready for democracy since that seems to be becoming the quickest route to ruin.
Why is it all Lobsong Singe supporters do not use real name. Why old monk, daveno, HTGT, all fake names. Are they just one person. Maybe LS himself. I know Tenpa Gapshi is a real fellow, also Mila Rangzen is real man. Jamyang Norbu we know.
There is something fake behind LS campain. Who is behind it
Pasang,
why is TNT supporter keeps asking questions and demanding answers? (LS la should clarify this and that….)
Be a man and campaign for your leader by showing what your leaders could do,what he got and let him say and prove what he will do instead of hiding behind few websites.
Show the tibetan people that he is the only one and prove it to them.
only then can i be in a position to say that we have another leader to compete with.
Daveno,
I am not a TNT supporter but I think you are mistaken in thinking that I am asking LS about “this and that”. I am actually asking LS supporters here, you included. Can you tell me why are you voting for LS.
Please, Charisma is not enough or even necessary (remember Stalin and Mao had lot of charsima)
Experience – I think even you have conceded that TNT clearly wins on that.
Academic qualification – Well, this is relativistic in today’s world. Having bookish knowledge doesn’t necessarily make a great leader. Besides, I am not very impressed by the constant waving of the degree in front of my face.
Future Plan / Mandate – I haven’t heard anything concrete yet from either candidates. Let’s say we won’t get a clear answer from both. Then the only yardstick I am left to measure their potentiality is their past achievement, Which TNT clearly Wins as he has a proven record.
But don’t worry, I am still not decided.
kalsang phuntsok,
watch each one of the katri debate where both of them TN and LS took part, and tackled questions. LS clearly distinguishes himself with his wit, political know-how, history of the world, accessibility, and assertiveness. Did you ever see a debate when TN outperformed LS?
If you’re voting for TN, change it to Tashi Wangdu la. The latter is more qualified, assertive, experience, energetic. He has no charge of corruption or record of ditching TGIE for his children’s education. If you’re for Rangzen, go for Kalsang Phuntsok.
Otherwise, LS comes out as the best candidate. And, we need to check eligibility of TN to stand for katri in Charter since he “resigned”from it. TN may get disqualified after rummaging through our TGIE quosi-legal charter, which runs CTA.
“Demagogues VS Democrats”
An article on Civil Discourse on Tibetan Political Review.
http://bit.ly/fRFCdL
Kalsang phuntsok la,
If you ask me why i choose LS la.
He is only one with the qualities that i see needed in a leader for tibetan people like me.
Not just based on Harvard degree,there are quite a few tibetan with it,but it does come into equation in total package.
I do not look for past experiences and achievement like you do,things have changed and past strategic thinking are now outdated.
my believe is that the experiences a leader needs is not that of the position itself but other transferable experiences that would be more beneficial in making decisions and leading.
If experience would be the main crietra for electing a Kalon Tripa then let’s all forgo elections and let the parliment appoint the person with the most experience.
Would this satisfy some of Kasur Tenzing Tethong’s supporters?
personality wise i can stand both the candidates despite some rumors n shortcomings. even the so called founding fathers of ari have their darkest side. not that i excuse it but policy wise i have problems with LS. many of his statements n views regarding future tibet is revolting. how can any one joke about a cause bodering on life and death? heard about this dr. 2 years ago n was very eager to know where he stands on our cause. did my tour of the innermost political recesses of his heart n mind. bottomline is he sincerely does not believe in, among other things, independence.
i would have voted for him if he is independence in disguise n fighting election lets say even against tenzin gyatso for the katri office. i have nothing against this guy personally. to speak of malice, i do not know him in the first place.
i very much appreciate LS supporters and others on this blog or anywhere else to use their real names so our discussion, debate or call what you will becomes more real, serious, sincere, responsible and accountable. for 99.9 % of us there is no consequences whatsoever. someone aspiring to a be a kalon this term might fear losing nomination when, not if, tetong becomes katri in 4 months! and i can understand that! some of you seem to be my friends offline. friends and my countrymen, stop hiding behind fictitious name! come out real! i believe in the art of democratic handling of our issues and situations. i dont believe in goonda gardi in politics for one simple reason. it will get very ugly. times have changed now. it’s no longer one sided. yes, i dont want to give any opportunity to our elders to cry foul “look at the attitude and conduct of these so called younger generation, so hopeless! let’s give back katri and everthing to HH or lets have samdong as katri until he dies! so i request in advance to any supporters of LS or tetong to get rid of any bhihari politics if it’s already lodged in your brain and keep it as democratic and friendly as possible, ofcourse be assertive and go full swing! i welcome that but i discourage unnecessary rhetorical personal provocation and dumb physical aggression in the streets as much as i despise timidity in our leaders. be assertive in a nice straight way!
bdhechen, can you lead me to a picture of this negative regional force called the academician markham tenzin chodak so i can do my research to see if the allegations are wellfounded? thanx
There’s another great one from Tenpa Gapshi on Lobsang Sangay’s premiership: “The Young King and the Sea” http://bit.ly/gqeExK
Daveno and Old Monk,
You have given me nothing. I have seen the debates and I agree LS is impressive when debating, but I haven’t heard from him Anything substantive. I don’t mind that he doesn’t have experience but then he should atleast provide some kind of an idea what he intends to do if elected to make up for his lack of experience. I Wont vote for him based on a couple of debates. OK let me grant u that he has plans to tackle our situation with regards to China (which I am sure won’t be anywhere near groundbreaking), he may not want to reveal it for reasons I can somewhat understand. But he doesn’t have to be secretive about his plans, if he has any, with regards to the political / administrative structure of CTA. I haven’t heard anything. Can you ask him to promise to do atleast one of the things I have suggested in of my previous post. Can he tell how he intends to fulfill this promise?
Daveno,
You are absolutely right. These people know that LS is sure to win, so they set up different websites to support TNT. By the way, this name TNT appears like some kind of Transexual Show.
I am wondering where the hell Jamyang Norbu was hiding when Chinese media misinterpreted his articles on democracy. He even didn’t post a word in comment, forget about rebuttal.
Although his website was registered in 2006, he started blogging in March 2008. Paraphrasing everything from news media and from historical records.
Phuntsok #111,
Jamyang Norbu might be blogging only since 2008, but he’s been writing on the Tibetan and Chinese political scene since 1978. And since you don’t seem to know much about him, during these thirty-two years his unwavering arguments have been proven correct and acknowledged by world experts.
Check this book review written by Warren W. Smith Jr., you may learn something: http://bit.ly/eTfKLq
TNT is the Distinguished Fellow at Stanford University. http://hcbss.stanford.edu/people/index.html
As well, he is the Chair of the Tibetan Studies Initiative. His job is not to conduct research as such there is no expectation to produce research papers. The honour is conferred to him by the prestigious university.
As for his age, he is around 62. His experience and 40 years of service might give illusions to people that he is ‘old’. Here is an opportunity for Tibet to benefit from his enormous experience.
If you watch this video of TNT making a representation at the US Congress http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhZNOYHIg8A You will see his capability. While the majority of the Tibetans were asleep in India, TNT was fighting the fight. Watch this video and you will see his tenacity, his sharpness, his legal arguments. If one did not know his background, he is sounding like a legal academic as he makes the points. This work, by the way, is what made the congress declare Tibet an occupied territory.
Now to LS, the official position title is “Research Associate” in the East Asia Legal Studies Program. It is not a teaching position. He is not a professor nor a lecturer. His position demands that he produce research papers. Unfortunately, there is none to be found. There are much work to be done on the legal research front regarding the status of Tibet. None have come from LS.
So, beyond the superficials, if one is to truly assess LS’ credentials, there is not much to judge. http://scholar.google.ca/scholar?hl=en&q=Lobsang+Sangay&btnG=Search&as_sdt=2002&as_ylo=&as_vis=0
For the sake of the future of Tibet, I am urging people to truly examine the merits and claims of each of the candidates.
Once you evaluate the credentials based on merit, TNT is a much safer and better choice for now.
As I have previously stated, the more you research rather than being stuck in your own beliefs, the choice becomes much clearer.
@Monk, as stated, TNT is a Distinguished Fellow with tangible results that he has shown from his part-time appointment through Tibetan Studies Initiative. LS is a Research Fellow with no published work.
Folks, let us keep our discussions to the records of the individual candidates rather than personal attacks.
@Phuntsok
Give me a break. JN is the best writer in Exile. He has not only written extensively about Tibet but also worked for Tibetan community by forsaking his career starting from Mustang to TIPA.
While LS who is about 40 has no record of community work experience to date.
Guys,
Yours Agu is back after being cut off from the internet. You can tell right there, i am not related to TNT, the so called, “Kudrakwas.” If i am then i shouldn’t be suffering from this digital divide.
BDECHEN, I am in fact, related to LS because i am from Shichak and i eat Dre, Tingmo and Dali. And i grew up with BAchuk, Jathi and Jabsi. However, I am not sure if LS has experience such thing although he claimed he did. THe last time, i checked, he was from Darjeeling. Oh! isn’t he Kudrakwas because he is from the famous Hill Station?
Does this kind of logic sounds familiar? Probably not! This logic comes from LS famous quote, “Obama of CHIna.” LS thinks he can be Obama of CHina because like Obama he is a harvard graduate.
When PROF. Carlson asked, “Obama edited the law journal, did you?” LS answered, I did the Human Rghts Review! Now if this is not a Lie (and he is a liar), then what is it?
That answer not only makes LS a liar but shows a complete lack of the understading of inductive and deductive reasoning. What Prof. Carlson was essentially saying was that not all harvard graduates are same (Dra Dre nang ne Medrawa Yoe re).
You Tell me if LS ever an editor of Harvard HUman Rights Journal? If not, what do you call him? a Joker?
Bdechen, I know Dr. Tenzin Choedrak has a phd in education from University of MA, Amherst. I am not sure if he is an acedemician. All i know is that he worked for Tibet FUnd, and he is a very devisive and sectarian man. You know what he no longer works for TibetFUnd because he collaborated with Markahm Chithus Sonam TOpgyal to unseat Richen Darlo. It didn’t work. Thats not relevant here.
But, if you think i am a liar, Check with Fullbright High level Scholarship committee what was LS ranking in Fullbright entrance test. If he wasn’t placed in the WAITLIST, then I’ll give you 42 worth of LS in kind.
HTGT,
I am not old monk. I do not belong to the older generation. I belong to Younger generation, much younger than LS ( he is kind of OLD too). I don’t like old people- i like the young and i believe in change.
Yes, I do believe in Change, not in LS. If you want to vote for Young and for change, Vote for Gyari Dolma. We need change. since we are not looking for change in policy, let vote for CHANGE IN GENDER Of Katri.
TGapshi, Thank you for your enlightening round of rebuttal. It will a generation for LS supporter to appreciate and understand your point. Keep writing, man. You must have a MUSTACHE!!!
ITS BETTER TO VOTE FOR LOSANG WANGYAL THAN LOBSANG SANGYE. WELL! AFTER ALL, THEY SHARE THE SAME FIRST NAME. THATS EVEN BETTER BECAUSE IT COMES FIRST. HAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHAHAHAHA.
YOU GET IT, BUDDDY.
YOURS AGU
ON A VERY IMPORTANT MISSION TO ENLIGHTENED THE FOOLED TIBITI.
1. LS rhetoric speeches on unity, many people find it hard to digest. On the one hand he discourage sectarian but on the other hand he voluntarily participated in Lithang tenshug, in that event he made a very strange comment to justify his presence. LS seems also ignorant of negative forces present in our society eg. shugden tsokpa, taiwan phok zachen etc, it is immoral and impossible or a ordinary people to get along with these groups in the name of unity. This shows that LS dint understood the gravity of unity in exile tibetan.
i want to add in this that, in 1994, Tethong(kalontripa)along with sangdong rinpoche(chithue tsokto) handled those taiwan phok zachen in very effective way thats why they tagged him “kuma” and made life hard for Tethong to live in Dhasa.
2. On the kalontripa debate tour of Majnukatilla, as-usual LS tried his best to relate himself to the audience. while doing so he mentioned “there was time when i faced difficulty in passing my university exam, because of involvement in TYC programs. If i failed that time then I probably end up today working in call center and restaurant”. if he(LS) had failed in university, many people said, then he should have said would have worked in TGIE or any other organisation for the Tibet cause. This reflects LS’s self-centered attitude even in his imagination.
3. Talking about LS’s political background, LS initailly belonged to old chushigangdruk, on some disagreement, he later joined new chushigangdruk. where he served as secretary in Dhasa. when he left india on fullbright scholarship, ofcourse he left secretary work uncompleted with also some monetary embezzlement. you can contact to new chushigangdrung members in dhasa to clear up your thoughts.
4. LS has stated that the purpose of his stay in US last 15yr is solely for the cause of Tibet nation. but many people astonish to hear that he dint took part in any govt. or non govt. organisation. More importantly, it is above common peoples ability to interpret how he got such surplus money to exhibit.
conclusion: we are not in luxury of time and space for a kalontripa post a place to get experience. we should not vote for a person who may look nice in the office, rather we should vote for a person who is experienced enough to take responsibility of 6million tibetan on a journey, with advancing age of HHDL, may behold lots of problem.
Let me tell you about Tashi Wangdu.
His friend, Juchen Thupten, failed him this time. Thats what most of the people are saying in INDIA, specially Dharamsala. He wasn’t gonna run for Katri. Utsang Tsokpa wrote him several times to be their list and many people requested him to in the election.
He wrote to Utsang Tsokpa, that he serve in Kashag for 17 years and he is not going to run for this Katri. Utsang Tsokpa has three candidates on their nomination list, only one decided to stay.
When Tethong seems to have no contender from Utsang, Juchen and others who hate Tethong manipulated and insisted Tashi Wangdu to run. He is a great guy but he can’t be a leader because he can’t say “NO” when he wants to. I feel for him because like TNT he served the TGIE when there was a dearth of educated civil servant. I had a huge respect for him.
What was so disheartening is that he can not exercise his own critical thinking. He not only betrayed his own constituencies, but tried to harm a great candidates votes and the future of Tibetan nation by indirectly helping a novice person to the post of KT. By entering in the race a such late time indicates his ulterior motives. His intention was not to win but to harm others.
Tashi Wangdu’s reason to refuse Utsang nomination was a lame one if not an outright lie. He said, he said no to Organisation nomination. I can not believe in this explanation. He not only declined the nomination by an organisation but also self withdrawn from the Kalon tripa website maintained by Tsetan Samdup which was infact nominated by common people like you and me.
In a nutshell, he wasn’t ready and do not want to run for Katri election until someone, and people points to Juchen Thupten, changed his mind. I do believe in this hypothesis because of the above mentioned facts and i know for sure that Jcuhen and his group like twangdu becuase he listens to them always. Unlike him TNT was tough, brave and smart leader who often take hard decisions.
Yours Agu,
Both Lobsang SanGAY and Lobsang WanGAY have one thing in common but I don’t know what that really is.
Don’t make up Disney sort of fairy tales, Agu. TNT campaigner’s arguments are invariably laden by the words like JUCHEN THUPTEN,etc…when that guy is nowhere to be seen in the current political scene?
I have enormous faith, respect, and admiration for Tashi Wangdu la, who in no single way lag behind TNT, if not more deserving. Tashi Wangdu should be promoted with greater pomp for the coming election in March. My choice is LS first, and if he doesn’t make it, tashi wangdu will be the next best.
tashi wangdu is way better than the senile, world-weary tethong.
Now, given the fact that LS outperformed TN in preliminary round, I would promote Tashi Wangdu la.
I agree with oldmonk.Tashi wangdu la is the second most deserving candidate of our vote.
Kalsang phuntsok la, since you got nothing from me, be happy with the nothing and i appreciate your honesty.
AGU TOMPA, you forgot paypey and japtok
(ofcourse you would know what “godhaguru” stands for you are the one anna).
We do not want katri with old strategic formula and someone who already served in that position.He will warm up the seat and thats all we will get in return in 2020 for electing him.
Since my leader will be
THE LEADER OR KALON TRIPA LOBSANG SANGAY LA IN 2011.
I can now retire happily from this campaign.
So long,countrymen! and woman!
Here is something interesting to read.
http://renaissancetibet.blogspot.com/
thenorbu / Daveno,
As the TPR wrote it in their essay “Demagogues vs. Democrats” http://bit.ly/fRFCdL, Rinchen Tobgyal, the author of the blog you mentioned, is the web manager of Lobsang Sangay’s website. Needless to say that his stuff is badly one-sided…
Agu, you are myopic at best. Don’t mix up ramayan with your own concoction of ram and ravan as matches. Far from being friends, Juchen was the very reason Tashi wangdi did not accept the post in the past even though he had the chance to. Juchen was always opposed to Wangdi becoming the chief. Juchen is the source of all political intrigue today and sad thing, he is very close to Jetsun Pema.
Juchen is behind all the political drama from chushi gangdruk taiwan scandal, his bullying of sonam topgyal, the laloo, masterminding the chitue divide and fight, the infamous hearing of special envoys, you name it….this guy went to Tibet a few times in the recent past and he was greeted there like a VIP – even more “glorious than HH” according to a supporter. With such treatment, Juchen can do anything to please his masters. His political rhetoric have been dangerously misleading, sectarian, even outright lies like HH is calling for a “Autonomy – without kham” etc etc…. no matter foolhardy khampas get enchanted with this man’s enormous penchant for public speaking and conspiration.
He even has a huge hold and sway outside his domain of handful of khampas. He successfully convinced a lot of u-pas like karma choephel, tsering choephel and lodoe sangpo to play divisive politics within the utsang, thereby weakening the utsang. His main targets have been those upas who are doing well – like Dawa Tsering yongling school case – juchen’s men were behind his case in the indian court. juchen also targeted the u-pas in Nepal, who were perhaps the most successful of all clusters of Tibetan refugees in the subcontinent or the west. It seemed that he and his followers could not swallow their hard earned riches. I will def heave a sigh of relief if his man passes away.
Christophe/TIBET,
You are free like anyone to throw your opinion. which some may agree or some may not.
Agu Tonpa, this time you sound much interesting with all the jatis, ras, kyis, bachugs, and other stories from schichak.
Then again the legendary aku tonpa was a con-man of sorts, adventurous, but never a visionary or a leader, so on wonder he seems to b your hero.
Keep entertaining us. I am having good laugh about your comments. As to your mission about enlightening Tibti, I’ m not very sure.
When i said you are the other side of old monk, I didn’t mean literally. What i meant was you are on the extreme right, and he on the extreme right. Both hate each other, but both are equally harmful to an open free society: like the Nazis and communists, both arch enemies but equally destructive to liberty and freedom of the whole society!
Here is an interesting article, investigating “Obama of China” statement by Lobsang Sangay.
http://renaissancetibet.blogspot.com/2010/11/investigating-tpr-and-jamyang-norbus_6175.html
A well written article that can be called fair and balanced.
TD
friends, lets refuse to entertain the topic about Tashi Wangdu la. Lets not take their bait. It’s like the Chinese patronizing Penchen Rinpoche in order to reduce the influence of Dalai lama and thus divide the country in pre 1959 Tibet.
I believe the purpose of the priliminary elections should be to weed out the least voted candidates and select the top two candidates for the final contest. Tashi Wangdu including Gyari Dolma, Lobsang Jinpa and others at teh bottom should withdraw from the race, or EC should DE-LIST them.
Tashi Dhondup #127,
See my remark below regarding Rinchen Tobgyal, the author of the article you mentioned. Being the manager of Lobsang Sangay’s website, his contribution can hardly be labelled “fair” or “balanced”.
http://bit.ly/fRFCdL
To say a piece is a ‘fair’ or ‘unfair’ mainly depend upon where one stands on the issue and the environment where one grew up.
The piece by TPR against RT could be fair and just for those who believe in the ideology imposed in the piece by the TPR, but could be unfair and unjust for those who carries the same ideology as RT.
Rinchen topgyal pieces are by far the honest contribution i have read.
@ Lhakpa 124
If there’s Juchen with his intrigues there’s the gyari’s with their parasitic behavior. with Juchen you know where he stands but with the gyari’s there is no knowing where they stand, what their next move will be. there is no room for princilples but pure politics of survival. here today there tomorrow. unlike you i dont wish death on anybody not even my worst enemy but i really hope that this present political evvironment changes and that there is awareness all around.
Looks like there are lots of Sarah Palinites who have problem (as she did) with elitism. Don’t we all (except true sanyassis) aspire to become elites? This sour grape attitute is so un-Tibetan and disturbing. Having said that:
Happy Thanksgiving to one and all. Except to the Chinese. Sorry. I can forgive but only when they let go of whats mine.
Daveno (alias thenorbu, Namgyal Lhamo#130 and Sonam Rapten#131)
If you decide to “retire happily from this campaign”, up to you. But please, don’t use this place for a monologue under different identities…
Golok Ambum, Webmaster
thenorbu, u r caught!
Waoow! It looks like Old Monk and Daveno have decided to overflow this blog using different identities… Sorry guys, but I take the responsibility (without Jamyang’s authorization) to delete your comments!
Golok Ambum, Webmaster
Going through all that is on display is very dizzying. Why this polarization of opinion in the Tibetan Diaspora? From one point of view, this is positive. The Tibetan exile community has, if not fully but to a great extent have shed their herd mentality of the past and have come to their own in having individual views and opinions. This sort of development is detrimental to the rule of those who think that they know what is best for the community. In their hubris, they think they have a divine right to know what the Tibetan people want.
Things have changed. The world is marching, and marching forward. In a sense, it is not just a march forward, but an acceleration. The acceleration of history is beyond the imagination of so many of us. Whether it is a good thing or not is beyond our ken.
LS and his supporters may bask in the sun of contentment for winning the primary elections. What about the things that follow? A greenhorn catapulted to lead the herd through plains rife with prides of lions and rivers infested with schools of crododiles. That is the reason why people talk about the risk of electing LS Katri.
We have nothing against LS as a person. He is educated, articulate and all that. In the history of the world, if I may digress a little, with a modest pretension of being a student of world history, out of the blue leaders have successfully secured the fate of nations and peoples. Cincinnatus, a simple farmer was chosen as the commander of the Roman legions to ward off the onslaught of the northern tribes. Cincinnatus after defeating the northern tribes returned to his farm to continue his life as a simple farmer. These days we have professional politicians. Once they join, they are here for life. Would LS return to Academe, be it Harvard, Yale or Columbia, if he were to be elected the katri and serves his five or ten year tenure?
In the past, for Cincinnatus and his kind, politics or leadership of the community during a time of crisis was a duty to secure the fate of the community to which they belong. Nowadays, it is a prefession at best and a sinecure at worst. Things have come to such a pass. It is better not to expect grandiose things from people who are like ourselves, selfish and self-centered. The great English Romantic poet, Wordsworth says in one of his sonnets, simple living and high thinking is no more, we are selfish men.
2 things. i heard samdong is campaigning against youthful candidate. true? phayul forum is not yet back. anything to do with katri election? curious!
i am also wondering why phayul message forum is not working at all. any reasons? thank you.
Christophe and Pema,
Jamyang Norbu started blogging in March 2008. Let’s say he started writing seriously since then. In these three years, he has only two articles for Huffinton Post (reproduced from his blog) and one article on Oragon Live (Taking a stand on China), ignored by phayul, even by his own blog. He was even caught requesting phayul to please publish his works under phayul rather than “By Email”. Embarrassingly enough, his later writings are published by email, not by phayul.
Now coming to his writing since 1978, how many books he wrote? Let’s see: Mandala of Sherlock Holmes. Is it a novel? No, which means not based on creativity. It’s a pastiche, we all know. The U.S. edition (publisher stop reprinting) says “Edited by JN”. A rare thing to see in fiction works. And do you know how many years it took for him to edit this pastiche? Ten years, ten fucking years. I happen to check some of contributions to Review, all reproduced on his rangzen blog – heaven save the hands who typed those lines – and stopped going further beyond few paragraphs, know why, all are just reproduction from historical records!
Now let’s see his other book: Horseman in the Snow, reissued: Warriors of Tibet. What it is about? It is about a man called Aten. Yet again a work which required not so much creativity.
His other book, Buying the Dragon’s Teeth, published by whom? High Asia Press, run by him. Why they stop reprinting? Although it is supposedly “extensively extended” work, but the book ends after hundred or so pages!
No Media, Think Tanks, Institutions and Universities are excited about Jamyang Norbu. They have avoided him from giving any talks. We have only a student’s group (the same group reigned by his famous cousin now defunct Lhadon for two-terms) to invite him for a talk. Or fake rangzen party branch.
I am 101% sure that his future works, if there will be any, will be published posthumously. The guy is fortunately a healthy man at 65.
Phuntsok, and this is related to Kalon Tripa matter how????
All the good things have side effects if not consumed in moderation. Even take the case of the Internet, which is perhaps the most revolutionary invention ever of human beings, yet it has side effects like giving opportunity to spread nonsense like that of Phuntsok in # 140.
Whoever gets elected – Please- be your own man (Good luck to that!)……
Don’t get sucked into all the manipulations & intrigues by Gyalo, Gyari, Juchen, and their sychophants …….blah blah blah……
Phuntsok #140,
Tell me, do you feel better now, after such a release of anger…?
If yes, consider taking a deep breath and reading old issues of the Tibetan Review (when it was still free of any interference from Dharamshala) to ensure yourself that Jamyang Norbu wasn’t “writing seriously” before March 2008.
Check also one of his essay, which was written exactly twenty years ago: “Opening of the Political Eye: Tibet’s Long Search for Democracy” http://bit.ly/gTfpIc. This might help to heal your own myopia.
I any case, your attempts at discrediting Jamyang Norbu won’t bear much fruit — except maybe among some of the most extreme supporters of Lobsang Sangay who are now looking to wage war against him by any means; unlike many Tibetans who wrote on Tibetan affairs, including His Holiness, Jamyang Norbu’s analyses have proven absolutely correct and unflawed. Unlike many others, his stand hasn’t been shifting according to Beijing’s tempo or to the guidelines set by Dharamshala’s Ministry of Truth. This alone makes a great writer.
#115 Agu Tonpa
You are enlightening those of us somewhat ‘out of the loop’ more and more with each of your commentaries.
@Phunstok:
What has LS written. Nothing but zero compared to JN.
Old monk and Daveno are nothing but various manifestations of Lobsnag Sangay and his aptuk Rinchen Topgyal. Mr Ambum has done a good job by identifying these destroyers of sound social discussions. They are at it and I am afraid what after these unethical misuse of such public discussion forum. For a simple Kalon Tripa seat, I think they have completely shed their Tibetan identity. Shame on you.
Hi Phuntsok,
I am gonna call you Richen Topgyal, just for fun. So Rinchen, why are you so angry against those who spoke truth? I thought we are discussing about Katri. But if you wanna talk about Jamyang la’s writing and if i believe you for a minute about your statement, then such is the state of the standard of our writings in exile.
After all, we have no comparable writers in exile who can challenge Jamyang la’s writings, his ideas and creativity. So, if you think he is nothing, there isn’t anything for TIBET.
“Let’s see: Mandala of Sherlock Holmes. Is it a novel? No, which means not based on creativity. It’s a pastiche, we all know”
Well. I don’t.
Rinchen, what is a pastiche? Can a novel be a pastiche? You better believe this or else i’ll pour the whole mariam webster dictionary into you dura mater of the brain. A Pastiche is a Stylistic imitation. So, a pastiche can be
a literary, artistic, musical, or architectural work that imitates the style of previous work (Webster dictionary).
To say that pastiched work is devoid of creativity is height of stupidity and was emblematic of the LS and his supporters way of reasoning (based of unfounded facts and figures). Let me sum up by saying this, How can this book worthy of Crossword book Prize, India’s equivalent of the Pulitzer Prize? And i believe that the other contender for this award was a book by famous writer Vikram Seth, right?
Richen, You have also conveniently left out Jamyang la’s other creative writing such as 5 different play he composed while at TIPA. Its gonna take so much of your time which otherwise can be devoted to you shabby LS campaign websites, to list all the merits if JN.
“No Media, Think Tanks, Institutions and Universities are excited about Jamyang Norbu. They have avoided him from giving any talks.” Well, thats not Jamyang la’s fault. It is just that those Institution has no balls to stand up for whats right. And now you are becoming part of those individuals and institution.
Had JN been more of flip-flopper like LS, he will be everywhere even in China long before LS could set foot in CHina. JN was invited to china by the chinese regime numerous times. He said big NO. He is not a collaborator with the chinese nor with their sympathizer. Thats why, he is not popular within Tibetan community leave alone those institution.
If he had been an ass-licker, flip-flopper like others, he will be everywhere, may be a friend with Goldstein, Gruntfield, Stautman. He probably may not enlighten you and I with his writing such as the “BLACK ANNALS: GOLDSTEIN & THE NEGATION OF TIBETAN HISTORY (PART I and II)
Rinchen, We have a saying, you probably may not know because you are an exile kudrakwa who didn’t ate Dre and Dali and lived with Jabsi, Druel, MigpaGyalep, and PHORoK, and didn’t attend CST. They saying goes like this… Dranpo She-na ME Mega, Gyukpa Kher-na Khi Mega.
yours agu,
Lhakpa,
I agree with you totally. TashiWangdu’s collaboration with Juchen is a rumor indeed. But, i do believe in this rumor. Tashi Wangdu is a good Friend of Juchen. Thats why, he is not controversial and “Clean”
Had he not withdrawn earlier, he would have my vote and he would win this election. I don’t wanna say this is but he is not decisive and can’t decide what is best for himself.
Yours AGU.
Bdechen,
You and Richen, I gave up. You guys are enlightened in some other ways. I am not thinking you are even Phenpowa, one who happen to as smart as Agu Himself.
Yours AGU.
Agu tonpa, nice to have you back. Can you enlighten me how phenpowas can be so fool?
Never heard about that in my life!
is aku tonpa real? wat century was he born in n his birth village? wat about gesar? real too? drukpa kunley? drupthob thangtong gyalpo? details please. thnx
aku tonpa is just a legend. gesar too was a mythological story. the rest are real historical figures!
JN,
Did LS send you yet the Harvard video recording proving otherwise Chinese Obama? 45 days have passed since he said he would produce the recording to settle it once and for all. If he hasn’t done it as yet then OBVIOUSLY he has nothing to prove!
For the sake of our cause and our democracy, we all must take part in this upcoming elections and make every effort to educate our general Tibetan public in Tibetan settlements in India and especially all the monks in South Indian settlements. They all must be well informed about our both the leading candidates. It is really important for them to know the true contributions and service record of TNT of last 40 years. They have to know his proven loyalty to His Holiness and all his accomplishments. Well informed public and especially, well informed monks will strengthen our democracy by their participation and well informed voter will vote for the right candidate in final elections. Democracy is well served if our general public are well informed about our all candidates.
All the well-informed and common Tibetan people will vote for Lobsang Sangay except for those who have “Cholkhae Shenkhog” (regional sentiments), the elitist relics and their chamchas.
This is on record: Kudraks were oppressors. It’s them more than the monastic community that we lost our country. Who’s in here blaming the likes of Bapa Phuntsok Wangyal to be responsible for losing our country. JN as a Kudrak stock has always tried to clear Kudraks of this attribution.
Many questions has been asked to LS. If you get answers to all these questions, proving LS free from these charges or if he gets cleared from all the accusations, would you vote for him? No, you will not, because you are only pulling his legs. It’s clear to all that you are trying to hurt his image. I can easily see the letters issued by the Sherig Full Bright Committee and the Harvard letters on NDPT website. You just need to scroll down a bit to find the following:
National Democratic Party of Tibet issued a press statement about Dr. Lobsang Sangay
25th August 2010, Dharamsala
.. and just below that you will find the link to the documents. (They should have put the docs in a different application than Flash.)
Christophe and other JN stooges, so do you think that JN’s article is “fair and balanced”?
Do you think that JN and others ranting against LS is called “fair and balanced”? JN has always been yelling against TGiE. But today he is going
against what he has been against. Now he changed his mind because his ‘cousin’ needs his help.
So, who is shameful — JN or the others trying to stand by truth and justice? It was JN who wrote the piece based on lie and selfish intentions. It was to tarnish the image of Lobsang Sangay to give way for TNT. What a cheap tactic. JN must have understood by now his standing and the way the Tibetan community has evolved.
The younger generations are particularly aware of what’s what and who’s who. Writing deceitful and manipulative pieces will not work any more. If you want to be outspoken, be that on the basis of truth and reality.
It’s true that JN has been writing since ’70s, or should we say ’80s. However, his writings has always been that of Rangzen vs Umey Lam; that Rangzen is and must be the only goal. He can hold that stand and work accordingly. Don’t just remain beating about the bush.
We must not forget that JN is a fiction writer and and idealist. Living in a fantasy world and a real world are two different things. My interest in his writings waned over the years. When a Chinese government write-up quoted JN, he
remained silent as if his was appropriately quoted. That’s a food for thought.
The point is that we all know who we will vote irrespective of a high degree, experience, American citizen or not, wife Tibetan or not, completed a previous kalon Tripa term or not, young or old, etc. etc.
I will vote for, and Jai ho, Lobsang Sangay!
then he opens his mouth and removes all doubts. sighhhhhhh
Tashi Dhondup,
“We must not forget that JN is a fiction writer and and idealist. Living in a fantasy world and a real world are two different things.” You are soo sweet… 😉
Open your eyes poor and misinformed Tashi Dhondup and watch the video below how LS is a regionalist pig. I say again all the Khampas with Shenkhog to vote Gyari Dolma.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E84KXGkNE3c&feature=player_embedded
I heard recently that LS never paid his green book dues till the TGIE announced the amnesty program. Can a person with such a loose character serve as our Kalon Tripa???
No way folks!!! Just go and vote the first female candidate for the post of Kalon Tripa.
As someone raised under the heavy feeling of “imminent threat” courtesy of the mainland Communists, I have a question which I hope won’t offend. Where I grew up, whether it was a government leader or political leader or church leader or visiting teacher even, the unspoken question often nagged, “Is this person even in some small way on Beijing’s payroll?”
I realize this kind of paranoia can be as destructive as treachery itself. And yet, I find it personally impossible to not to have that kneejerk fear, “Is this person bought off?”
In my community here in the States this issue is very painful; everyone’s afraid everyone else is རྒྱ་མི་སོ་བ།. And yet every time we want to say, “Okay, enough paranoia,” the fear looms again. Also, almost like child abuse, we all (in my community anyway) often avoid talking about it because it’s too shameful and disturbing. Just bringing it up immediately raises suspicions itself.
This very same issue, with all the same painful & ugly aspects, plagued the struggle against Nazi Germany and no doubt countless other oppressive occupations. Is this a legitimate fear for current elections? Or is it going way too far?
I get shivers down my spine when I hear the word Gyami Sowa and that too with one of our Kalon Tripa candidates. Oh! Konchok Khyen, dhida mayinpa shog!!!
Two of my earlier comment postings are deleted from this blog, hmmm??????
@kyulo
you must have written some one-sided rubbish, nonsense as usual that demands censoring!!! Enjoy!!!
i heard that TNT is a hired by American CIA. you know the treachery and sophistication of CIA, how it used Tibetan guerellas in 1960s for their own state benefit of handling the spread of communism, but cheaply dumped our warriors during Nixon at the change of foreign policy. Now CIA might have found some new benefit in this Tibet issue, and cleverly bought off that TNT, and he’s a puppy under the strings of unseen master lurking behind.
TNT should clear up his name by providing evidence of disassociation with CIA. In addition, it seems, if floating words are to be believed, he’s an American wife, and doesn’t even possess a Green book. What sort of katri will he make, when he’s such murky background?
And, why is JN supporting a chap pursuing Middle Path rather than a Rangzen wala, eg. kalsang phuntsok? is it because of their cousin-ship? is it because of the bond of Elitist Relics, feeling “uncomfortable” when a commoner rise up on the political platform?
I guess a big problem is that in order to address the issue, you have to conduct the equivalent of “political drug-testing.” In other words, treat someone as potentially guilty in order to determine innocence.
So, there’s no really ethical (imho) way to ask, “Is candidate A, B, C or D clean?” Just to ask it implies they could be dirty, which isn’t the point.
In the modern world of slimy Guoanbu holier-than-thous going around buying off elections or stealing ballot boxes or threatening people’s grandmothers, the point is simply to continue to keep one step ahead of that slavering beast that is the the CCP. With that kind of threat always at your heels, one is always making decisions under stress.
In my own town Chinese students and employees lurk around yards and driveways taking photographs of Tibetan families. In the middle of recess Chinese men appear with cameras at elementary school playground and point them at Tibetan kids. Movie script? No, everyday life for Tibetans in Madison, Wisconsin. The CCP demon is omnipresent.
We never did truly address one single suspicion in our community in the old days, that I’m aware of; everyone just went around with worries nagging at them. Or if the adults talked about it, they didn’t do it in front of us. In talking to my uncle a few days ago, he feels his parents’ generation was just inclined to accept whatever happened, and not confront it. “Pray for protection; we’ll be okay,” etc. And also, to be very polite; and accusing people is not polite. Then in his generation, having more freedom of travel, there was a feeling you could just “get away” if you had to. Now today in our generation this snake is coiled up on our own sidewalk.
But maybe one really does have to have a bit of faith; otherwise paralysis would set in before even getting bitten.
@ Sheila
Are you seriously suggesting Chinese nationals taking pictures of Tibetans in Madison are pawns of the CCP?
Do you actually THINK the powers that be in Beijing care about the everyday activities of a few powerless and poorly educated refugees half way across the world?
I find your description of this paranoia exceedingly humorous. To be frank, there are COUNTLESS espionage targets more worthwhile than the Tibetan diaspora in the US.
I guess I’d better schedule a trip to Wisconsin to snatch a few pictures of Tibetans, heh?
Chines engineer,
You may not be aware of it and don’t want to believe it but when Tibetan students going back to visit Tibet are apprehended at the Tibet Nepal border they get interrogated and then shown photographs of various monasteries and schools in Dharmasla and told to identify them. They where shown photos of students and people on the streets. In one instant one of them saw the photograph of the mad man of Mcleod Ganj.
Tibetans also have experienced Chinese people shoving cameras in their faces during the Olympic protest in 2008. It’s possible you don’t know of it but lot of the Tibetans in SF, NY and other cities experienced it and know that for a fact.
By poorly educated refugees do you mean those not well versed in reading and writing in English and other western cultural and traditional ways? I did notice many chinese are uncomfortable with their Chinese names and tend to change it to David, May or Michelle.
Something Freudian going on there?
Pawnbrokers, actually. Every picture earns bucks or tickets to a Badger game courtesy of China Consulate-Chicago.
The problem with freelancers is lack of subtlety–at times barging up and shoving a camera right in the face. Face-recognition software needs a decent photo, and with zero repercussions for being rude, why not? Others use gargantuan cameras for the same reason.
Suffice it to say the same machine working against Tibetan individuals is working against Tibetan elections. Hopefully unsuccessfully.
Once it was considered rude to announce your name as a candidate; but this uncomfortable idea was swallowed for a better-functioning democracy. Maybe other slightly-rude new habits, like carrying cameras to snap pictures of the picture-snappers, are now called for. Sometimes the host country will do the right thing (Canada did, expelling Wang Fengpei, er Pengfei, for spying on uni students).
It’s daunting to make progress within Tibet, but in democratic countries there so many freedoms and legal avenues; we should use them constantly and relentlessly against the CCP machine.
During current elections, the machine’s activity level seems extremely high; if there’s going to be camera-carrying, now might be the time.
Here’s a “college student from Madison” (consulate worker from Chicago more likely) sporting a rather stunning option. No doubt the ginormous telephoto is for souvenir shots of “fellow students” he’s marching right next to. (Warning: Olympic mascots visible)
http://www.flickr.com/photos/emilymills/2428158000/sizes/o/in/photostream/
@Tribalism
Did the students have valid Visas? I’m guessing no.
@Sheila
Are you suggesting that the CCP is building a photo database of the Tibetan diaspora? That sounds pretty hilarious, although not impossible.
Chinese engineer, Of course not. Do’t you know that the Chineese don’t issue passports to majority of the Tibetan populace because they are not really Chinese.
Engineer – it’s long-known the CCP has a photo database in progress of Tibetans worldwide. Tibetan-Americans for example have been stopped by authorities at the HK airport, and shown photos of themselves taken in America. It’s not a question of whether it’s happening, but how to combat it using every means possible (personal, public, legal, diplomatic,…)
It may rarely be necessary to pursue legal action, because by the time you have the information required, you likely have way more than you’d ever need for an embarrassing public or diplomatic spectacle the local consulate wants badly to avoid. The beauty of the internet and a free press.
Think of the Nepal ballot box incident, for example. Was a stolen peek at a small fraction of Tibetan ballots really worth yet more “bad China” headlines?
i heard that TNT is a hired by American CIA. you know the treachery and sophistication of CIA, how it used Tibetan guerellas in 1960s for their own state benefit of handling the spread of communism, but cheaply dumped our warriors during Nixon at the change of foreign policy. Now CIA might have found some new benefit in this Tibet issue, and cleverly bought off that TNT, and he’s a puppy under the strings of unseen master lurking behind.
Did you see Rachel Maddow or Chris Matthews replaying the Fox tv anchors starting a sentence with “some say…” or “They say…” or “I heard…” and then continue with the most blatant lies they pulled out of their behinds.
I wonder whether any of the Wikileaks cables will mention anything at all about the election, the China and Nepal factors, etc. As of this morning there were only about 5 cables originating at the Beijing embassy, some mentioning the Dalai Lama traveling through London, but no election discussion. But I see there are more now:
http://cablegate.wikileaks.org/origin/36_0.html
Choeyang,
I am absolutely flabbergasted by your unsubstantiated and misinformed charges against TNT. I really hope you are not serious. Only the Chinese and the sympathizers ever use the CIA backed charges. Khoerang Bodpa yinpae?
Not that it matters, You are also wrong about TNT’s wife being American and about gyalthon mang-ngul contributions.
Debate on the merits of the candidates not wild accusations.
LS should pull the leashes on his supporters. In his name, majority of LS supporters are spewing out all the Chinese propaganda against Tibet, HH and the Tibetans.
In their excitement and zeal to support LS, they fail to see the fundamental flaws in their arguments.
This is getting way too vicious. Ironically, LS claims moral superiority by claiming unity as one of the pillars of his campaign.
Please argue discuss on the merits of the candidates and their positions.
Let’s discuss the merits of electing a kudrak who used to be Kalon, and kalon and Kalon Tripa, who abandoned the office of Kashag before his tenure was up. Are we talking about selecting the head of Tethong family or are we talking about electing the head of Tibetan government in exile?
If you go to Wikileaks and try to click on the “Embassy Beijing” link, it will now take you to the Embassy Buenos Aires cables instead. This was not the case earlier this morning.
When you get to Embassy Buenos Aires, change the “31” in the web address to “36” and you’ll then be on the Embassy Beijing cables page.
Is there anything that isn’t hacked any more, having to do with China and Tibet?? Or did Wikileaks change it? So bizarre.
It’s too bad we can’t get the candidates running response to some of these issues; for example, what would each candidate’s official response be to the Wikileaks cable which holds China responsible for hacking the offices of TGIE? Or, how would each candidate handle the developing situation in Tibet regarding language suppression?
Here’s an excerpt of one Tibet-related cable:
¶15. (C) XXXXXXXXXXXX raised concerns over China’s “core interests” of Tibet and Taiwan, which he said could “derail” bilateral cooperation.
[The US’s response below]
¶16. (C) The Charge expressed concern with China’s defining Tibet as a “core issue” with the apparent expectation that others would “step back.” Instead, our two sides should agree to continue to discuss the issue in an attempt to resolve our differences. The United States recognized that Tibet is a part of China. Nevertheless, the Dalai Lama is a respected religious leader and Nobel Laureate, and U.S. officials meet with him in that capacity. Future meetings by U.S. officials with the Dalai Lama could not be ruled out. Moreover, there were serious concerns among the U.S. public, the Administration and Congress over the situation in Tibetan areas of China. China should take steps to address Tibetans’ legitimate grievances and engage the Dalai Lama’s representatives in productive dialogue. Denying a visa to the Dalai Lama was not being contemplated.
These bits and pieces of conversations are just conversations. It’s nothing to be taken seriously as these aren’t classified CIA documents, documents that contains highly analysed assessment of state affairs.
ད་སྔོན་འགྲོ་འོས་བསྡུའི་གྲུབ་འབྲས་གསལ་བསྒྲགས་བྱས་ཚར་དུས། མི་མང་གི་བསམ་ཚུལ་ལ་གུས་བརྩི་བྱ་རྒྱུ་ཕར་བཞག་ནས། མི་མང་རྨོངས་གཉིད་ལས་སད་མེད་ཚུལ་བཤད་ནས་མི་མང་ལ་མཐོང་ཆུང་ཁྱད་གསོད་བྱེད་འགོ་བརྩམས་སོང་། ད་ཡིན་ན་ལྟོད་མོ་འདུག
Thank you Sheila. That’s interesting. I saw the wikileaks but never somehow thought to look for something about Tibet!!! Duh me.
My goodness, there is so much venom here around. Why this venomous shadow boxing? LS and TNT would fight it out in their own merits. The Tibetan Diaspora would decide in their own terms. When I go through all the comments, it becomes apparent, that something big is at stake and BIG and BIGGER players are involved in this exercise.
LS and TNT. LS as a up and mobile academician (I am not sure whether he is one already or not) hell bent on to turn the tables on the Tibetan establishment esconched for the last six decades, and TNT (TNT has something to do with nuclear power and the destructive power of the explosion generated by it) are in for a nasty fight. Both the front runners have to dance to the tune of the Tibetan Diasporic hulla bulla. I do not envy them. They are in for all sorts of revelations. Hope their cupboards are devoid of skeletons from their past. Ted Kennedy and Garry Hart came so close in achieving their presidential ambitions, yet fell on the way because of the skeletons from teir past breathing down their neck.
Someone here tries his best to denigrate the achievements of JN as a creative writer. I find it in bad taste. JN, in spite of all his faults, for that matter, all of us as humans are neckful with faults, and therefore there is the dictum, to err is human, is the only, I emphatically once again say ONLY creative writer in the Tibetan Diaspora, whose books have been published by renowned publishers and have been well received by world class crtitics. We Tibetans are an envious lot, trying our best to pull the legs of those who march forward. This shows our parochialism and provincialism. Our past still haunts us. Such atavistic tendencies in our mental recesses crop their ugly heads now and then. It would difinitely take some time before, we get rid of them. You cannot wish them away, they have to be cleansed step by step.
waiting for TNT’s name to pop up in wikileaks website in regard to his alleged associative with CIA. he’s a CIA agent, like those Gyalo Dhondup, which are in the secret list of most wanted people with highly controversial, secrative background, with their aristoractic background, and relavent connections everywhere.
Beijing prefers LS? Why?
But now the CCP suddenly has a war to worry about rather than enjoying its hobby of destroying Tibetan elections & textbooks. Maybe Tibetans can get a moment of peace, and North Koreans can eventually get some food and hope.
@ Tribalism
ལགས།ཡིན་དང་ཡིན། དེ་རིང་ལྦི་ཀི་ལིཀ་སི་རྐྱོན་ཤོར་ཤག། Guardian ཡག་པོ་འདུག། 🙂
Couldn’t log onto Shadow Tibet for about 20 minutes just now.
Topix is a cesspool, but probably less likely to go down than other sites so for anyone interested I started a thread there with summaries of the Tibet-related cables:
http://www.topix.com/forum/world/china/TJO28DUB8KGFP1C4C
Will continue to add to it as they become available.
I really hope LS condemns the allegations made against TNT by people like Choeyang claiming to be his supporters. I hope LS disowns them publicly.
“I heard that TNT is a hired by American CIA”
Choeyang, you are probably hearing a lot of things, like people who are suffering from mental disorder. I recommend visiting the nearest psychatric hospital before the CIA captures you and forces you to decode Chinese newspapers.
Haven’t been able to get onto Shadow Tibet for past 5 hours or so – anyone else experiencing this?
Yes, this site was down for some time. This isn’t the first occurrence. You might wish to speak with the webmaster.
Are you sure that Beijing prefers LS? If I were a hardliner, I would like to see an adamant Tibetan hardliner in power, so that the TGIE could be increasingly marginalized after Dalai Lama dies. And “hardlining” is in vogue these days in the Capital.
I think LS is a very dangerous man, because he is a relatively new departure from the old mold.
TNT is more dangerous than LS,because history has shown the treachery of elite relics, that brought the fall of our nation.
Phayul was hit by DDoS, now Shadow Tibet, pretty simple. Is it the rising protests in Tibet, elections, or both?
The only question is who will do the best thing for Tibet and Tibetans beginning right now. Family pedigree doesn’t matter in 2010, if it ever did. What matters is who will address the needs of the student below. This poem was written in Chinese.
~
“Sorry”
Using the 30 letters of the alphabet
You string a necklace of history for me
But I, due to the ravages of time
Lost my principles
Lost my necklace
Thonmi Sambhota, sorry
Father and Mother, sorry
Forefathers, sorry
Teachers, friends and family, sorry
What you carved on stone
I am unable to understand
Tsangyang Gyatso’s poems
I cannot read out loud
I have no tsampa
I have no Buddhist lamp
I have no mala
I have no khata
Today, I have also lost my voice
From today onwards, there are no pastoral songs
There is no Achi Lhamo
There is no kyi kyi suo suo
There is also no Mani and sounds of nature
It’s not that I don’t love you, sorry
It’s not that I want to abandon you, sorry
I am powerless, sorry
(Sawuche @ Tibetcul)
~
RENAISSANCE SERIES: Amplifying Everything Banned in Tibet ངའི་མ་སྐད་ནང་། ༔ སྐད་ཡིག་བརྒྱུད་རང་དབང་རྩོད་པ། LIVE STREAM 7pm EST http://bit.ly/gfy89V
There is very little for me to choose between Kasur Tenzing Tethong and Dr.Lobsang Sangay.
I am for Rangzen and I do not expect either of these candidates to deviate from the edict of His Holiness Private Office.
My reasons for leaning towards Dr.Lobsang Sangay is the ‘unknown’ factor.
He could be a bust and that would still be the status quo of (apathy gone wild) or with a slight slight slight and slight chance give us hope to be proud again and that is to fight for a Free Tibet.
As for Kasur Tenzing Tethong I do not question his credibility nor do I question his experience……but if he could just show me an ounce of Lhadon la’s passion then my vote for a Tethong would be sealed.
Folks, please read this short article. I also strongly suggest these peole who stay around the Dalai Lama should read the artcle and give HH some advice that HH does not has to have opions on all sorts of matters, bot spiritual and worldly affairs. Yes, it is time to retired from travelling and lead the Tibetan people to our belove homeland!!!
http://www.mid-day.com/specials/2010/nov/281110-dalai-lama-tibetan-government-twitter.htm
thanks gangchenpa for sharing this article. the author makes some relevant points.
that’s why we need to ban lamas from occupying political positions, something which His Holiness himself endorses!
Secularism is the need of the hour!
MILLION DOLLAR QUESTION.. WHAT IS THE COMMON BETWEEN LOBSANG WANGYAL AND LOBSANG SINGAY.
WHY CHINE PREFERS LOBSNG SINGAY
tsering topgyal,
don’t worry about TNT’s passion. TNT is one of Lhadon’s heroes. He has the right combination of passion and charisma. He is the most ‘prime ministerial” of all the candidates.
What is it with Tashi Wangdi la now planning to accept candidacy. He has no hope in hell to even come close other than split votes against TNT. I have had and continue to have great respect for him but not if he is going to throw his name in simply as a political move. If he was serious, he should have committed himself earlier during the preliminaries.
I know LS has been in discussions with TW, is there a deal that we are not aware of?
Oh, there will be deals made from both sides. Nothing surprising about it. But I had hoped he would prove otherwise as I have tremendous respect for him. Lets wait and see.
I love circus masters filled with lies and speculations.
They are much more entertaining!.
Nyima la
Worried I am not.
There are many reasons why there are two times the vote for Dr.Lobsang Sangay than for you candidate Kasur Tenzing Tethong.
One primary reason I would guess is that your candidate despite his immense resume has failed to inspire voters.
Politics is many things …be it the candidate’s platform or his/her past record…but above all it is ‘American Idol’.
Tsering Topgyal, If its “American Idol” i dont want to be part of it.
Tenpa Dhargyal Gapshi and Nyima, on the one hand you say you have great respect for Tashi Wangdila and same time you talk about his deal making. Do you know him well enough to speculate such things? I think he is above all that kind of stuff.
Lately the air has been rife with rumors, innuendos & insinuations tinged with just the right dosage of facts to come off as believable.
I believe the original culprits stirring the pot are not even supporters of the 2 main contenders. They have their own agenda. Now all this has spilled over to supporters of the actual 2 contenders and now we have both candidates accused of being superpower agents and the whole gamut.
It’s an act of despicable rudeness to complain against Kasur Tashi Wangdu trying his luck for katri race. He is competent, in every bit if not more, as TNT, and I have great hopes TW will increase his vote during the actual election, and come on equel footing with TNT. TW is a well-respected official in TGIE, both in offical and non-official circles, with record of long, impressive government service.
Some people are trying to wallow in the oft-quoted adage of George Owell, ” All animals are equal, but some are more equel than others.” And, they’re making TNT more ‘equel’ than TW.
In fact, TW is more experienced than TNT, if experience is what counts. Come on, let’s not clamp on a most ideal candidate.
Has anyone read for yourself or for your kids story of seven blind men and the elephant, with each blind men describing what the elephant look like, from the perspective of the part of body they touched. That is where TN’s supporters are here. That is exactly LS and his proxies’ intention is.
Hello! LS has moved his gear and is speeding ahead. LS and Agu Juchen Thupten were reported to have met in Darjeeling. Juchen is reported to have advised LS that he shouldn’t worry so much about winning Katri election. According to him, LS has already won. Agu Juchen’s advice for LS is to strategize to get favorable people to get elected as Chithues. So LS is said to be using two prong strategy. One, assure some good khampa chithues like Youdon and few others of possibility of kalon position while in fact their main aim is to make sure Juchen people get into chithue in landslide.
Two, LS has started anti-campaign against many U-stang chithues who he and Agu Juchen thinks as problem.Jamyang Dorjee, Dawa Tsering and that Ngari monk chithue in Delhi. Some of young LS mouthpiece are now surprise at this real LS.
Agu Juchen is said to have advised LS to focus more on north east while Agu juchen assured that he will take care of south indian settlement. The two seems to be united by their combined hatred for a family with a name with G. So TN people, train your eyes on LS journey to north east. Dalai Lama is visiting Sikkim, more people gathering and LS is harvesting.
Who knew Agu Juchen is LS real god-father. Kasur by the name of Chonjor is reported to be go in between. Do me a favor, don’t tell this to kusho Palden Gyatso.
@Mountainlakeman, read my statement carefully.
@Devono, we know you love circus masters. It shows thru and thru.
@Laughing Buddha, very interesting. I certainly hope LS thinks he already won because that would make our job that much easier. 🙂
What can i say about OUR OWN Tenpa.I have nothing but happy to announce that you guys keep my day entertaining!
Tashi wangdu is much better candidate. There is no scandal, solid uptodate experiences, lhaksam nampar dakpa, never left his position, knows his limitation by first not accepting his candidacy,but given the people that are in the race,i humbly accepted knowing he is much better than many like TNT.
Daveno, glad to know I am big part of your life.
If it was between Lobsang Sangay and Tashi Wangdu, I will vote for the latter in a heartbeat. Does that answer your question?
Thank you Master Tenpa!
I haven’t asked a question.If i have to ask one for you.
TW or TNT?
Lobsang sangay la is my candidate and not yours.
You can’t vote for him.
kasur tashi wangdi, gyari doma and losang jinpa, please withdraw from the race with dignity! you have no hope. thank you.
Gyakhab rangzen, you’ve no right to force worthy candidates to withdraw from the nation’s biggest political event. It’s too early to predict who will win or who will not, let the election come.
Games are not always about winning, but also about losing, and learning from them. There’s a dignity in finishing last, as long as you give a sincere effort.
Thank you.
plus kasur tashi wangdue has a huge chance of winning the election. He’s a highly experienced man, if it’s what matters.
old monk with his dick in his skull,
many argue tetong has only some possibility to win. i agree for the most part but the rest have absolute no hope! their fate is sealed by the prelim result. why humiliate oneself further or is it just a political move to divide tnt’s votebank? ! those who voted for the 3, most will vote for older n experienced tetong. dignified withdrawal is the call of the hour! well while i appreciate their participation i must also remind them now its time for them to let it go! honourable exit!
they all hav some gud individual stuff. i agree. but losang disappointed me beyond imagination with several of his lunatic views that resolved me to leave no stone unturned in getting tetong to the office. between the two teong is my guy. willing to lay down my life to get him there! not because of who he is but because he comes thus far closest to my idea of a free and democratic tibet. that does not mean he can or will atleast attempt to act on those ideas but so far thats the best i see. losang can go for chithue this time.
what CHANGE is losang or his supporters are talking about? just a change of face/faces in kashag? a new driver in the same old ambassador car? please concretize his promises atleast in words here. big thnx.
Gyakyab Rangzen!
You remind me of the those bush walk or walk in the forest behind Sera and many technique employed to nail the moment!!He he!
There is no question that Tashi wangdu la is far much better than Tenzin namgyal tethong la.Anyone who disagrees are not being honest with themselves.
Leave Losang sangay la.He is the elected or the chosen PM.There is nothing to discuss on that.
For vice-PM, Tashi wangdu la is no doubt the best.
I have seen jamyang getting very close to observing the tibetan political scene from the grass roots level- choka choluk and those associations. But i never heard him talk about gyalo, juchen, alak and jetsun pema who seems to be the real politburo members of tibetan exile empire. Oh and ngari rinpoche. Who are they and what roles do they play behind the scenes…
Is LS really bought off by Juchen?? LS was in the NEW chushi gangdruk when he left for USA. And Juchen, we all know is the mastermind of the Taiwan and lithang athar scandal…so he should be positioned with the OLD chushigangdruk. If Juchen is insisting on LS as his legit son, can the adoption be made legal??? What does LS think about it??
Lately, I believe Jamyang la has left his position of Robin Hood of sorts to put his stakes in high flying political gambles — involving his kith and kin. But i feel sore for him as his is a losing battle with LS leading by a wide margin in prelims. But I sympathise and encourage the ongoing hoopla about TNT despite his negative image in the public. Democracy demands it and we should have it.
As far as Tashi Wangdi is concerned, he was yinluk tsulden, because he respected the official rule that says you can’t campaign before you are in the prelims and also that you can’t campaign as long as you hold a public office.
What LS and TNT did with all the campaign in the name of democracy is actually illegal – a trend that is very disturbing…a political tool used effectively by Thupten Samdup in the first place.
If Tashi Wangdi la seriously contest now onwards with effective campaign….I am sure he can oust LS too….only setback being the new arrival khampa parasites in the monasteries in the south who Juchen has promised for LS.
But unfortunately, Tashi Wangdi la’s campaign is low key. His supporters including the stupid cousin in Tibet Fund are too dumb for a contest like this..
LS for PM, TW for Deputy-PM. Or, even the other way round. Both are very competent candidates. And if TW starts campaigning, which i believe he’s planning to launch at the last minute, an innovative bid to leave FRESH impressions in the voter’s mind.
of course, if he does well, he may even outdo LS. and i really don’t mind that as long as katri is in the hand of a capable, honest, and visioned person.
Oh come on, Old Monk, don’t even pretend. If you had valued experience, capability, and vision why were you not on Tashi Wangdu’s camp to begin with? You are just saying that so that it will split the vote for Tethong. How is Lobsang Sangyi even remotely a competent candidate? What are you basing that on? Is it because he said change?
Oldmonk la,
Thank you for your honest view on candidates
(Very difficult to find one with so many lies and speculations flying around).
Your suggestion sounds much better for Tibet’s future.
Very interesting read !
But supporters of both Tenzin Tethong and Lobsang Sangay, in their efforts in spinning off rumors,accusations and counter-accusations, missed the most important happening in the Katri pre election.
The official website of CTA (TGIE) has declared Lobsang SENGE as the leader of pre election. So Lobsang Sangay is out of the Katri race. Here is link :
http://www.tibet.net/en/index.php?id=ann&annid=34&tab=7
I am going to vote for Lobsang SENGE. Because :
– He is from my shichak (settlement)
– He belongs to my father’s birth region (Cholkha)
– He is a very good business man (wealthy)
– He is a highly regarded scholar (Geshe)
– He had helped his monastery in many capacities.
Please join me and vote for him !!!
A friend of mine told me that Old Monk is none other than Lobsang Wangyal of Miss Tibet Beauty Queen. He swears that he saw the name old monk in his dialogue box. No surprises here.
Lots of things are being said about Tashi Wangdue la in India. He is a nice man. In fact, a very, very nice man in the league of TN and many others. But visionary he is not.
A person who self withdraws himself from Kalon Tripa nomination (check kalon tripa.org website) and then refuses U-Tsang and Mangsto Stogpa’s endorsement but have an overnight change of heart and take the plunge into electoral politics when approached by a disrobed monk and a known joker in US-Tibetan community called Thokmey? I think it is not called vision.
In American politics , there is a word for this and it is called: flip-flop. For us in India, the closest equivalent term will be Bata Chapal. So here goes the reputation of this nice man, thanks to the company he keeps, Agu Juchen and likes of Thokmey.
But people say TW is no stupid. They say there is lot of larger issues involved here. Agu Juchen thinks, for LS to win hands down, TW has to become a pawn. People are saying TW will become one of the most important minister with at least two significant portfolios to begin with. But some are saying, he wants to go back to US. ICT? NY office? Don’t know.
If you believe everything that is being said, you won’t be able to believe anything. But from what is being said, most of the things still seems to lead to Agu Juchen’s door. Heard Gyari Dolma meeting Agu Juchen in Palampur. Also heard Alak Jimey meeting Agu Juchen. I think he is still not finished. We also heard that Agu Juchen and Kasur Pema Chonjor told LS and his people to spread the rumor during the primary, specially among the U-tsang population that TN and Juchen have a compromise and Juchen promised his support for TN on the condition that TN will give Karma Chophel a cabinet post. Their plan is that U-stang public hate KC and this talk will do damage to TN.Like it or not, one person who talked a lot about this was Pema Delek in South India. But people say, he really believed it was true. We thought we almost done with like of Juchen and Alak Jigmey but their incarnations in LS and Thokmey are already active. It never ends.
But dear old twisted monk aka Lobsang Wangyal, don’t forget one day people will see through everything. They say, when the tide is gone, then you get to see who are swimming naked. I hope nice man Tashi Wangdue is not swimming naked.
@LB, I am already seeing TW naked even before the tide is gone.
Old Monk aka LW is, as always, throwing his cheap and silly shots in the air without the real weight to hit anybody. This guy is really cheap. He jumped into LS’s wagon with a few words of flattery from LS. Even if LS win the Katri Race, he will throw LW in the gutter and never look back.
Daveno and others are in the same league as LW. Just cheap like their head LS. All these people are talking big things and in reality lacks the basic knowledge of how to run a govt. LS with not even a single day’s experience of working in the TGIE office just has a mouth that is bigger than his head. You better understand that talking and doing are two totally different things. With cheap and ignoble people like Lobsang Wangyal managing his campaign, what can we expect from LS.
There’s another interesting piece by Tenpa Gapshi on rangzen.net: “Why I Support Tenzin Namgyal Tethong for Kalon Tripa” http://bit.ly/h4wJ90
A respite from all the negativity swirling around this discussion board.
Tethong is not someone who toots his own horns. Now have newfound respect for this man.
Always thought Tashi Wangdu & Tethong were alike at least in temperament.
Tashi Wangdi la did not want to be in this race. He withdrew himself. But towards the end of priliminary, on somebody’s insistance obviouly, he puts himself in. He lost it to be found himself at the bottom. Given the margin, a sensible man or the man his supporters describe him to be of…education, integrity and all…would say, Ok I gave it a try as you guys said..but results spoke for itself, there’s no way for me to win in the final; let me be neither ‘there’ nor ‘here’; let the top two contestants fight. I quit!
But according to the comment above by a Nyima, Tashi Wangdi la is willing to run for final election! This move is nothing but aimed at splitting the votes of TNT and thereby giving Lobsang Sangay victory in a platter – a dirty politics that only dirty people play!
For a man who wasn’t even interested in the first place, gets on board later because somebody insisted, and the dismal chance of winning the eventual result showed being enough for him to call it quits from the next round, still stays in the race, if rumors are to be believed, on the insistance of agu Juchen and his gang, to hinder any possibility of winning for TNT….just vindicates what Aku Tonpa said somewhere above, that This Guys Just Cannot Say NO! That he’s a YES man!
Tashi Wangdi la maybe ‘great’ man but what he’s doing in this Katri election as we get closer to the finals…is showing anything but his greatness!
I voted for LS-la in the preliminary based on the debate I watched on Youtube. After reading all manner of rubbish from LS-la’s supporters such as Oldmonk, Daveno etc, I began to wonder, with these kind of strange people as his supporter, if I am mistaken in supporting him. So, I’ve been flip-flopping like a chappal. But after reading Tenpa Gapshi-la’s piece in rangzen.net (thanks Christophe!) my mind is made up. My vote goes to TN-la! I’d be a very proud man if I could have accomplished 5% of what he has accomplished so far for Tibet. And he didn’t need to go to any fancy university either! I am sure he’d have kicked butt there too. I salute you TN-la for all you have done for Tibet and am in awe of you for still wanting to do more. Buddha bless you!
Tenpa Gapshi-la thanks for your enlightening piece. Like you said TN-la is too humble for his own good. If he’d listed all his accomplishments during the debate I and many like me would surely have voted for him from the very beginning.
The prelim results show that the race is obviously between LS and TN, and if Tashi Wangdi la has indeed decided to run anyway, it is obvious that he is running as a spoiler and it is also obvious, at someone else’s bidding. Hopefully, I am mistaken, if not, I hope TW-la has thought about the repercussion of his decision. If TN-la losses because of the difference of the votes that TW-la received, TW-la will not hear the end of it, people will compose little ditties, like they did in Lhasa in the past about the follies of the kungos, and sing them in the streets in Dasa. And of course, these songs will include verses of “good fortune” that come his way after LS’s win. So, do not listen to them kungo.
Hey Phenpowas,
I know you are enlightened now. But, listen up; This election will be a contest between TNT, LS, and TW. Unfortunately, TNT will come out as a winner with slight margin. Well! Not an unfortunate for tnt supporters, though.
Lets break down the vote;
TNT : 95% of Utsang, 90% of amdo, 25% of Khampas (95% of >30 y.o, 99% of highly educated, 10% monks)
LS: 100% orthodox Khampas, 60% monks, 60% of <30 y.o,)
TW: 2% utsang, 0.5% amdos, 30% monk.
If TW can chip away at least 30% of monk votes, TNT will lead in a bigger margin.
Watch out for my prediction.
Yours AGU
Apeasing the Master is one of the tool of followers to gain acceptance in the tribe.
I see nothing but followers appeasing their master with this and that logic.
I do not want to shatter your dream and bring a bad day to you guys cause i believe in Leyjudey.However, leaving you guys with false hope,i cannot do.
I hereby declare Lobsang Sangay la as The Honourable Second Prime Minister of Tibetan Government in Exile.
Temdrel Sangpo sheydrak rey!!
P.S. I would rather take risk than to wallow in the mud of mundanity! Ke he he!
Daveno,
Your comments are definitely counter-productive. If you persist in doing so, don’t be surprised of more Sangay’s supporters defecting to Tethong in the coming months…
Christophe,
Who is to say productive or counter-productive.
An opinion is an opinion..nothing more or nothing less.
To accept someone’s opinion blindly…..that generation has gone.
LS’s mouth piece Daveno conlcuded his message above with Ke he he!
This is what people like me are most scared of. LS is trying very hard to hide his “Ke he he “side and project an image of a leader. But however hard he tries, his financiers, advisers and supporters are holding their breath to say “Ke he he.”
Young and naive,please remember this “Ke he he” will take us nowhere.
Now I have a question for Jamyang Norbu. Can you explain what is the difference between LS’s Obama of China idea and Lithang Athar and group’s agreeing to be part of China in Bangalore long ago that got Athar crucified. I see lot of similarities. If patriots like JN could enlighten people, it will serve our nation well. No Ke he he here. I will just say Om Mani Padme Hum.
There is no doubt at all that a few Jabchung supporters who are writing all sorts of nonsense in the way of supporting their candidate LS is destroying LS’s little credibility more than the comments of his opponent’s supporters. Just look at the immature, visionless, childish and callous comments from LS supporters anywhere on the net and you will find out the real difference between the supporters of LS and other Katri candidates. Since the result of the prelims were announced, thousands of voters have changed their mind to vote for a candidate other than LS in the finals.
So, all LS supporters, behave yourselves while writing comments and have some CLASS. Don’t act like Yab-Longs!!! All the best.
The supporter for LS are all honest in their attempt, although in a naive way but smart enough to evaluate an individual’s worth for the leadership position.
The other supporter except supporter of TW la (They opinion seems honest) are manipulative,sophisticated,speculative,spreading lies on other candidates to gain some ground.
Just my opinion like yours.
I am sensing petty regionalism simmering beneath some of the comments here. Whether it is Utsangwas(or Toepas)or Khampas both sides have their own troublemakers. Amdowas generally seems to be neutral, but that may just be my view.
For those who think LS is riding on Khampa votes should just look at CTA census. Which region the majority (over 60%) of the exile population belong to; its Utsang or Toe. I don’t think it is only the khampa votes LS has, although he may have the majority of monastic votes from the three big monasteries where majority of the monks are from kham. That only means LS ran a good and effective campaign. There is no reason why TNT can’t do the same. He still has time to make a case for himself, that is, if he and his supporters wants to.
Moreover, I don’t understand why some people are digging Lithang Athar and Juchen etc. from their graves. As if there is not enough confusion already, that the conspiracy theorists have to jump in and spread their brand of BS.
@ ORACLE 228:
The main reason why Lithang Athar got into trouble was that he didn’t had the authority to enter into any such agreement with the Taiwan Bhoesog Lekhung (mind you it was not the Beijing government). Not even Chushi Gangdruk, of which he was the President at the time, had given that authority to him let alone the entire Tibetan masses. It was a reckless move on his part to overstep the authority of His Holiness and the Exile Government who are the true representatives of the Tibetan people. That is why it angered the Tibetan people but most of all the majority of the Khampas who were being dragged into this embarassing and unnecessary controversy by a silly mistakes of a few of their own. The split in the Chushi Gangdruk occured when Athar with help of his cronies refused to step down and hand over the office and the properties of Chushi Gangdruk in Majnu-ka-tilla.
I admire Athar for his courage and sacrifices he made for the cause of Tenpa Chapsi when he was younger but that Bhoesog Lekhung episode was most shamefull and ultimately the cause of his downfall.
LS’ policy with regards to China doesn’t seem any different from the current policy of HHDL and the CTA. Which by the way, I don’t support, as my position is that we must not give even an inch to the current thuggish government in Beijing. Treat them as they treat us. No compromise only protests until they give up.
Agu Tonpa –
You keep continuing to enlighten us ……………………Just have to ‘keep our wits about us’ & sort the wheat from the chaff.
what have Lithang Atar and Juchen to do with this election? Doesn’t make sense at all. Such history had long gone into dust and memories of exile years. Let’s plant new flowers, let’s walk a new path.
Let’s not steal the thunder from those who actually ran LS’s campaign.
Juchen is just a small fry in the big picture – though’ he & Agu Tonpa would like to think otherwise.
And in any case I believe LS’s role model is supposed to be Kasur Lodi Gyari!!
Now if that doesn’t make things intriguing enough.
There are those of us who will not play the ‘regional’ card. We’re truly open to the right candidate; AND above all quite sick & tired of these games the Big & small play.
New Tibet cables released – large summary here:
http://www.thetibetpost.com/en/news/international/1295-wikileaks-hu-jintao-inflexible-over-tibet-issue
Original cables here: http://wikileaks.nl/reldate/2010-12-04_0.html
daveno=old monk. daveno+old monk=lobsang wangay?
what location does the ip address point to?
well, if u r a sera monk then my guess is u r now from australia. nailing in the sera woods not much different from nailing in the bagsu streams. you can support any one n now that tetong has started entering in full war regalia i wish you all the luck but i dont appreciate backstabbing from a friend in hiding!
My apology Gyakhb Rangzen.
old monk – what have lithang athar and juchen to do with the election?? anybody denying their roles is just ignoring the legacy of history and it’s bearings on our poltical future. Any great stateman should not overlook history.
And seriously? Are you guys blind to the recent political ramblings involving juchen – the parliamentary hearing in Dharamsala which was called to answer questions raised by juchen on the document handed to china by envoys. Juchen is alive and kicking in the political arena. To deny that is missing the whole point of political debate amongst us. At least the present elections and the events before that should have opened our eyes to how our elders conduct their business and how we should accept their legacy even though we want to act like Americans just like the chinese. There is a Tibetan saying – kyug dro yang paphe phorba rey – so any would be political analyst should heed this warning.
Because we were being led down another path by a pied piper(s).
Thanks for that thunderbolt.
“unity, innovation and self-reliance” is really nothing new nor is it a specific policy or goal. it’s way too general that has been practiced by tetong and others to the best possible in the last five decades. but unfortunately they do appear like some earth shattering discoveries to the general public which works in favor of LS.
can LS answer these questions here with a seriousness it deserves?
What is his position on the China Tibet negotiations and what would he do differently?
What measures does he believe we, the Tibetan community in exile, can take to effect positive changes in the lives of Tibetans residing inside Tibet; especially those confronting land rights issues, unwarranted detentions, and inequalities in competing for education and jobs?
What would he do to revitalize our large Tibetan settlement camps and reverse the current trend of many young Tibetans leaving their communities in order to find employment elsewhere?
What would he do to improve the standard of education in our school system and how would he help young Tibetans preserve their culture while in exile?
vote for the right guy with the right policy!
no more dilly dallying!
vote for tethong!
with abosute zero chance of winning, tashi wangdi has decided to run for katri! wat a joke! motive is clear. lost all my respect to this dude playing cheap politics. he is after not so clean as potrayed!
gapshi hero, any moves?
he is afterall not so clean as potrayed!
gapshi hero, any moves
Don’t defame TW la. He’s solid record of public service, proven credibility of honesty, vision, and aura of dignity. He’s a highly respected man in our exile community, as you are aware of. And, it’s too early to throw cheap predictions, Gyakhab Rangzen la.
hahahha your heart is splitting into fragments as the scenarios turn favourable to the right men like LS and TW.
congraz to all supporters of Lobsang sange, you people finally succeed in expedite full retirement of HHDL.
Thats what you guys desired, our exile govt. without auspice of HHDL.
Lets see what “unity, innovation and self-reliance” you will render to the mass.
GAPSHI,
jinpa n khorlo withdrawal helps both LS n TNT equally. gyari is still in a dilema! her withdrawal should help TNT more but tashi wangdi staying in screws TNT’s prospects. heard he is resigning from office n planning to go full throatle on campaign.
that LS job interview is hillarious.
Job Interview Lobsang Singhi
http://www.xtranormal.com
Xtranormal | Text-to-Movie
Share
can tibetan interpretation/translation it be available?
apart from those big lasting human qualities it does TNT no harm if he
1. gets a military hair cut to project go getter look
2. dyes his hair with kala mehendi to beat LS’s youthful look
3. wears 2 inch flat sole black bata shoe for a bit imposing look
4. wears not hugely contrast color top n bottom wear for height enhancement
me stuck with some projects but if time permits in mar i will do the best i can in kollegal n sera n hunsur.
It makes no sense for both Dolma Gyari la and Tashi Wangdu la to still be in the race. If they are trying to be like Ross Perot, then they are actually succeeding.
I think his looks is suitable for his age and he does look quite handsome. I think if you are in the shichaks, you can definitely help campaign for him.
when shown them his pictures n videos tibetan aunties(not in a bad taste) go ecstatical “he is so cute! like amir khan!” their numbers strong but also easiest minds to alter! i think it will do ok even without g doma’s teary drops!
if the whole bunch can again run for the finals irrespective of who got how many votes, i wonder what’s the purpose of having ‘primilinary’??????
Kasur Tashi Wangdi,
You are no doubt a great candidate for katri but having showed up way too late on the scene, chances of you winning the race is slim to none.
So on behalf of Tetong and his growing supporters i request you to withdraw so tetong’s U-TSANG elders’ votebank stays intact.
Thanks for your participation that has generated some public interest in the election.
anyone willing to help us distribute leaflets n posters tomorrow for tetong at church hall, new york? let me know if u can be available during day or nite? big thnx. 9178890421 leave ur name n number n message incase i m not with the phone. big thnx
the campaign posters are gud but do not say much. lets also create leaflets with more info. lets work on it in my office today. if for some reason i cant make it to day n nite gathering will send some to do the distribution. can we expect some 20 lively distributors? how many people u expect to gather? 500 or 1000?
i must say tetong’s close supporters are not doing enough esp in the streets. too slow. often invisible or hiding.
seriousness demands full blown broadcasting! so people see n know their next katri!
tasks today
1. leaflet in english
2. leaflet in tibetan(not possible today, looking for a good translater)
3. collage of his color photos
1 n 2 should be distributed together to each individual out there
correction..1 n 3 should should be distributed together…
that gyalkhab rangzen is a nyompa, a fanatic lost in fantasy, heading blindly towards a tough wall. He will bang his nose badly,and fall down with a ‘thud’ and return to sanity.
Sluggish Tethong doesn’t have cat in hell’s chance of winning. long live kasur tashi wangdu. long live dr. lobsang sangay. Tethong for U-tsang Chithui.
if i am generating some frustration in old monk it could mean only one thing; his and his boss’ balls are on fire and i am half way through! the rest should be easy indeed!
tashi wangdi will continue as special europe representative -the importance of his being there was thoroughly explained last may by your samdong lama!
lobsang sangay as an english teacher in cst darjeling for year!
lobsang sangay as a political science teacher in upper tcv for one year!
lobsang sangay as a principal in lower tcv for one year!
lobsang sangay as a shinggo in mungod for one year!
lobsang sangay as a chithue for one term!
lobsang sangay as a kalon for one term!
lobsang sangay as a kangra wakeel for one year!
lobsang sangay as the “imagine the people!”
@Old monk, instead of calling Gyakhab Rangzen as nyompa, call yourself a coward mad dog. GR is brave enough to be open in this forum and calling the shots. Who the hell are you hiding behind the veil of pseudonyms and barking from behind the wall. Poor kutta of LS.
gyakhab rangzen as tethong’s head chef, if he (TNT) wins the election.
old monk, control! control kar yaar!
i dont need to be anybody’s chef. matter of fact i already hav a chef at rangzen restaurant!
you are most welcome for some sha bhaklep! enjoy it on the springy davenos here under the palm trees.
ok just give LS’s ideas here in brief on the following.
ultimate cause(independence or what?), education(one english medium school in india for 20,000 students?), economy(govt budget,20,000 destitutes upliftement, jobs for youth, culture(what part should stay n what part to go?, emigration to west(oppose or support?), agriculture(free seeds?) religion n matrialistic monks n lamas, miscegenation, health(measures on hepatitis b n aids, drug addicts n alchoholism), security(beijing gets daily info on wats going on in HH phodrang), international relations(going to speak n protest as pm with atleast all the tryninized asian peoples atleast?) election process( 1 vote 1 person? residence based voting system?)democratization, secularization, party system(yes no, bi or multi), parlimentary reforms, constitutional changes, animal husbandry and sweater business.
my guess can be quite accurate. are you TG/TN/MS/J/RT/LW/TC/CY? !
well a shot in the dark!
G.rangzen my friend,
“enjoy it on the springy davenos”.
Now tell me why am i being put in the middle of your offensive strike against OM.
I thought we were friend.
With our differences on political issues and taste on candidates.A friends advice:
Do not waste your time and hard earned money on leaflets stuff.This kind of method is for ‘cheap product’ marketing campaign in North America like “2 for 1 or buy 1 get the other for 1/2 price”.
If you are planning for “TNT+JN at one price” i am not the right person to comment on this.
Probably ok in India.
leaflets, internet, videos, posters, talks, friends, supporters, pictures, associations, all shall be used.
your “temdrel sangpo shedra re” is a raven to me since our encounter on the grassland of phayul.com so how can we possibly be friends? also those who lean away from independece.
leaflet paper in india so cool n cheap. here xerox paper not gud but wat to do.
phurbu in total spent $7000 on his limited campaign n LS may hav spent $30,000 so far. so a couple of $100 from my wallet should be ok.
just chill!
G-rangzen,
I didn’t lose my mind at that time in phayul grassland, i sold it on ebay!
I am an angel with only “temdral sangpo”, all you need is to put on your glasses well.
DAVENO is what people sit their fat ass on–a couch, temdrel sangpo marey! so i recommend you change your name to DEV ANAND an ever green bollywood play boy! n then play on a sofa of your choice to the hilt.
you sold your mind yesterday,
please dont sell your soul today
to an inexperienced arrogant political wannabe !
if you do, i will send agu tompa
to buy your shaggy ass tomorrow.
I will sell anything for mine and my countryment’s great grandchildrens happiness.
I respect you for standing by the result of your analysis of all candidates (if you have employed any analytical measurement to arrive at to select your candidate).
Like any veteran analyst,i standby with my result of analysis i conducted.
Time will deliver the result!
Till then, I bow my head with my tongue out for a friend!
“tongue out” is too feudalistic! not gud for your children’s mental health! anyway bye for now. got to go a long trip.
G-Rangzen,
Have a good trip!
I thought you are now in ‘Kudrak stage’ and ‘Tongue out’ was an appropiate mark of respect for that.
I might have understood incorrectly.
Davena and other LS mouth piece,
Remember more and more you talk, the silent majority like me get sick at people like you. We try to remain silent, but remember we are not scatter brain like you and your mentor LS. Like the ‘leader’, like the followers. Consider my vote as not pro-TN but anti -LS.
Rangzen and phayul is precious. I will not be surprise when people like you and LS takes control of Kashag, we are not far from for sale on E-bay. Sorry may be it is Baidu.com
Laughing B.
I respect your opinion like i respect mine.
Daveno,
More than two weeks ago you informed us that you could “now retire happily from this campaign” and you bade us farewell. Obviously, things are not going the way you had expected, uh…?
Why do you persist in making a fool of yourself? Can’t you understand Laughing Buddha’s and Young Punk’s remarks? With “supporters” like you, there will soon be more anti-Sangay voters than pro-Tethong…
Personally, I don’t care much about Tethong and Sangay, none of them are my type of candidate — by a long shot. But if I were to be fed only with your comments, I would definitely rush to join Tethong’s campaigners.
christophie, don’t make fake, malicious comments under the guise of neutral opinion-sharing. It’s very clear what your ulterior motive is. you people are disgusting, pouncing on LS with fury of jealousy…maybe that’s because he’s as young as you people, but is standing up for katri while you people are nowhere up.
deveno sounds very sober. much more better than that gyakhab rangzen and other radicalists around.
Christophe,
If you do not care about both the candidates, then why are you giving me advice?
I see.. you do support Lobsang Sangay la indirectly.I will secretly admire your decision.
With gyakap rangzen and other half-baked supporters of TNT shouting out loud…How could i sleep and retire.I do not want my counrymen being misguided by some “wrong perceptions”.
Old monk,
I’m not “pouncing on LS with fury of jealousy” but commenting Daveno’s foolishnes — and yours since you adopt the same illogic approach. Frankly, I’m pretty sure that Sangay would have preferred not to have to deal with supporters like you guys; you are only detrimental to his image.
Daveno,
If I had to support someone in this election, I would rather go for Tethong in these dark hours…
Thank you for your judgement on me as being foolish.I respect your opinion!
Draw or give a clear picture of where we will be after 5 years if TNT is in Katri.( please do not just mention the results,give an account of how that result will be achieved, and avoid making references to past which is not ‘after 5 years’).
Daveno,
A major issue divides us: you support the Middle Way while I strive for the restoration of Tibet independence. These are hardly reconcilable points of view.
Seeing from this angle, I’m badly disappointed by all candidates. None of them have the guts that such dark hours would have required. I would have hoped for a candidate with articulate goals. Not merely empty words such as “unity”, ” innovation” or “self-reliance”, but proposing a vision for Tibet’s future, such as independence, self-determination or something that would have radically demarked from the present Middle Way’s nightmare.
Tenzin Namgyal Tethong is not a hero and he won’t bring much change in the next five years. I have no doubt about it. But at least, I am sure he will do his best to limit any further surrender of the Tibet nation and to restore some confidence to the common Tibetan people in their right to live independent from China, a confidence that has been badly damaged by Samdhong Rinpoche during his two terms as prime minister. Considering how Samdhong hijacked the cause of independence for the last nine years, this is perhaps the best “Rangzen wallahs” like me can hope from the next Kalon Tripa.
On the other hand, Lobsang Sangay can only drive Tibetans further away any hope of independence by supporting the Middle Way and proactively engaging himself in friendly meetings and talks with Chinese. In terms of concessions to Beijing, he is the person who would not try to stop the bleeding but instead perform preventive amputations based on his own analysis of the Chinese law. To my eyes, considering that the communist regime is not going to move an inch from its actual stand on Tibet, this is far more dangerous than a gloomy status quo.
Finally, unlike you, I am convinced that experience matters. No one will let you drive a 40-ton truck with only a small motorbike license in your pocket, and no army will appoint a simple soldier as its commander-in-chief. This would be pure madness. Here, however, the fault does not lies with Sangay but with the curious elections rules set by the government in exile.
fully baked supporters of LS,
LISTEN UP!
While I respect and admire Lobsang Sangay’s accomplishments, I am concerned with the exaggeration of credentials. The often repeated claim is that he was the youngest CENTREX member in 1992. By the fact that he was born in 1968, he would have been 24 at the time of his election as the junior CENTREX member as Information Secretary. http://www.tibetanyo…/1992_1995.html will show that LS resigned and did not complete his TYC duties. TYC link http://www.tibetanyo…trex/index.html will show that TNT was indeed one of the founder of TYC. TNT was 22 years old at the time, making him younger than LS by two years when he founded TYC!
The other claim is that of Lobsang Sangay’s PhD dissertation. He DID not do PhD at Harvard. The degree was SJD. This is a research based degree that does not qualify nor allow him to practise Law in the US. He has NEVER practised Law! There are not many people who spent 7 years completing PhD or SJD for that matter. There is no significant work produced as a result of his tenure at Harvard.
I bring about these not to attack Lobsang Sangay but in the interest of fact check. There are too many other discrepancies for me to deal with.
Christophe,
Experiences matters for driving a forklift truck..i know that.
But leadership with experiences on the same position..i dont agree!Its much more than just previous life experiences( there is gap in TNT experience to present – you know this).
I wish you good luck that TNT wins the elections and fulfill your wishes to the state of mundanity!
GRangzen, i thought you were on vacation trip.Sorry that i bothered you.
I agree with Christophe.
It is sad that the most we can expect from both candidate is at best the continuation of status quo or at worst further concession to Beijing. The mentality of those who currently wants to be in power in Dharamsala is to wait it out while preserving our “identity” or “culture” or whatever the f–k that is. I don’t understand what they are waiting for. Somehow the sound of the panic alarm that has been ringing for the last 60 years has become a second nature to them. The most they do is hit the snooze button.
Why can’t our leaders understand that if they expect the amber of “freedom” to continue to burn in the hearts of the Tibetan masses, they themselves should be breathing fire all the time. That is how a freedom movement is conducted. It seems that they have become so comfortable in their lives as refugee in India or as citizens of western countries that they almost don’t care if they have a land of their own. This whole enterprise of exile politics is sort of a hobby for them to which obviously no goal of RANGZEN is attached.
I think it is quite risky for any one to throw his lot with any one candidate, specially when that candidate is silent on the most important issue of Rangzen vs. Assimilation. I would hate to find myself opposing the very candidate I voted for down the road.
If one truly evaluates the messaging and what each of the candidate stands for one will quickly come to the conclusion that LS is the most status quo candidate in this election. He speaks of change but relies on the old establishment. He speaks of leadership yet has not exhibited any. He speaks of unity, yet he is playing a very divisive politics. He speaks of vision yet has none.
We all care for the future of Tibet so for the interest of serving our country, let us pledge to be open minded and responsible and truly evaluate the candidates on where they stand. We have responsibility to be informed and not be led by empty rhetorics.
The pro-TNT commentators are hullicinating poppies of junkyard, far removed from the realities of the current politics, paranoid of the tiniest of departure from the mundane status quo, or a slight ripple of change. Their guru TNT fit their antiquated psyche of affinity for anything old,worn-out, and witlessness.
Those people are divided into two categories, one adamant vanguard of Elite Relics whose heritage lies in aristocracy, including the Lion King, aka JN himself. The second category is the gullible lot who are brainwashed into selling themselves out for those Elite Relics with sweet rhetorics. They have no interest ultimately, and will be easily ditched when those Elitist get to bite the pie, because they don’t actually belong there by blood. They are actually running dogs of ancient, feudal system, who survive under the knife of indoctrination.
Daveno seems to be the most sane commentator, probably a product of decent upbringing, with love for truthful judegement, even against the rising tide of horrendous political treachery.
biased websites like shadowtibet,TPR,phosamosa will be busted by the knife of truth in time. what’s the fucking debate b/w lobsang wangyal and choeyang in http://www.phosamosa.com which aired the pictures of only languid TNT? why can’t that freaking website come clear about its pro-TNT campaign? That really made me literally sick to my stomach, pondering the extent of childishness of such immoral endeavours. LS is fighting a lone battle against the old establishment, feeding the last flames of hope of the nation, in an attempt to restore our imperial glory after consecutive destruction by legions of aristocrats and clerics.
Nobel Peace Prize for Lobsang Sangay in 2025. May Tibet rise up.
Old monk,
How can surrendering to Beijing bastards help restoring Tibet’s imperial glory…? By “our imperial glory”, do you mean “Chinese imperial glory”?
And for Sangay’s sake, refrain from mentioning the Nobel Prize — you have no idea what you are talking about. This kind of immature fantasy is an insult to our intelligence and is definitely not going to help his campaign.
This is hilarious!
http://www.xtranormal.com/watch/7952725/
That is not hilarious Nyima la.
We are PHO-CHOKA and we prefer to settle personal issues in person over a cup of coffee or jaa.
I have never imagined that we as educated tibetan would fall that low in dirt.
Well, it was a wonderfully produced satirical piece on the issue of relevance of experience for this position. I thought it was a very clever work. I was impressed with the script.
I do not have much tolerance for mean spirited attacks. I did not feel it was malicious.
Really, Daveno? Why don’t you start by using your real name first. Talk is cheap.
we tend to forget our own failures and disfigured appearances–while making fun of others. I will remind every now and then…dont worry.
Tenpa ! I will have to eat more tingmo( i like kimtsang 18 amala’s tingmo) and then come out with my name to run against you for chithue position.
Talk and pieces are all cheap.You are correct!
Reading Old Monk’s comments remind me of some of rhetorics/songs used during Mao’s rule in china that children had to recite…like…
Chairman Mao’s word is stronger than ten thousand words,
Chairman Mao’s works are like the sun
Every word and sentence radiates with golden with lights
Father’s close, mother’s close, but neither is as close as Chairman Mao
Sun is rising, it’s not Sun but the radiant glow of chairman mao…etc.
That was funny Nyima and very creative too. Thank you. Not malicious at all.
Tribalism | November 22nd, 2010 | 1:48 pm
It is unfair to discount Tenpa Gapshi’s writeup just because he favors a particular candidate. In it he argues well and without venom which is what a good citizen is about. Incidentally I also happen to be a supporter of TN Tethong.””
For obvious reason!
@Daveno. Wrong Khimtsang. You expect people to believe you are PHO-CHOKA when you can’t even use your real name? Yes, you are right, talk and writing pieces are cheap. That is why I can’t support Lobsang Sangey as the next Katri. Maybe, if he put some time in the parliament and display his skills and gain some real experience, then I might be convinced he is a credible candidate. How would you know if someone can swim? By having seen them swim, of course!!
@Tendhar, wrong kimtsang or right kimtsang for you or me..i dont know.
Not every skills can be compared to one another.There are characteristic unique to one or the other.Give it a thought!
@SANGAY 287
Old monk is the VOICE
for those who are shy.
Old monk is the STRENGTH
for those who are honest.
Old monk is the DEFENDER
for those with truth and integrity.
And Daveno is the REFUGE
for those who are brainless.
Amen
There’s only ONE way to help Losbang Sangay win this Kolon Tripa election, and that’s by the use of Cultural Revolution style rhetoric in his praise and thereby brainwash the mass into believing he’s some kind of demigod. And this is exactly what his foot soldiers are doing day in and day out here, in shichaks and at monasteries.
Now you soldiers can even go ahead and claim LS can grow wings, carry us on his back to Tibet, and upon landing on Tibet’s soil Tibet will become free sending all the chinese packing. But in reality, in real world, if we scratch LS’s record, integrity, ability, experience that are necessary for the job, is only an inch deep or may be less….where as TNT’s can go deeper than one foot and you will still find yourself scratching further more…!
Another interesting post to read on Tenzin Namgyal Tethong: “Tethong’s words still ring true, five years later” by Tenzin Pema http://bit.ly/eUhCxe
ok below is a response from Tashi Wangdi site when asked for the withdrawal of him from the race. not making much sense. TW felt it a banishment when transfered from new york to brussels/paris. his resignation request was effectively turned down by samdong lama. the only way to get resignation n be free from govt service is by entering the katri race. his campaign wasnt serious enough nor will it be. he is hardly felt anywhere but after serving for so long he does deserve a quiet retirement. perhaps an early retirement that desung hero senge rabten received!
“”””Hello,
We truly appreciate your opinion but Kusur Tashi Wangdu-la will not withdraw his
name from this election. To do so would mean a lack of spirit in the process of
a free and fair democracy which His Holiness has tirelessly guided the Tibetan
people for the last more than fifty years.
The coming Kalon Tripa election as we believe is NOT about who gets more votes
or who should give room so that the other can move ahead. It is about whether
he or she can meet the challenging tasks ahead and perform the duties sincerely
and honestly as per the wishes of His Holiness.
Kasur Tashi Wangdu-la, currently serving as the head of our Brussels office in
Europe will soon be resigning and will be actively engaged in talking to the
people wherever possible. Please tune in on December 26th for a radio interview
with Radio Free Asia and on January 5th with the kunleng program with VOA. In
India, he will participate in the debate being organized by the Tibetan Woman’s
Association.
Kungo Tashi Wangdu-la if I may say so is more concerned about the process of
democracy than about who gets more votes or who gets to be the next Kalon
Tripa. We are being guided by him not to engage in dirty politics and to let
the people judge him only for the works he has done in the last more than forty
years. He even reminds us of a quote from Gandhi-ji. Let me share it with
you.
“POWER THAT COMES FROM SERVICE FAITHFULLY RENDERED ENNOBLES. POWER THAT IS
SOUGHT IN THE NAME OF SERVICE AND CAN ONLY BE OBTAINED BY A MAJORITY VOTE IS A
DELUSION AND A SNARE TO BE AVOIDED”. That’s what is great about Kasur Tashi
Wangdu-la and that is why we feel proud to support him.
We wish you the best and please do not forget that it is about getting the right
man in the hot seat and not about who gets to be the winner.
Senge Rabten
One of the many supporters of Kasur Tashi Wangdu-la.”””
Radio Free Asia Tibetan interview on Tenzin Namgyal la’s visit to Boston, which is the hometown of Lobsang Sangay la.
http://www.rfa.org/tibetan/otherprograms/newsanalysis/kalon-tripa-candidate-tethong-in-boston-fund-raiser-12202010143456.html/t122010rd.mp3/inline.html
TW won’t care about samdhong lama’s refusal; in fact, he’s above the integrity of samdhong–morally as well as intellectually–and will do his best to add spice to the katri elections in the celebration of our fledgling democracy. For him, it’s not about winning or losing the game, it’s about the participation with readiness, motivation,and energy. Who wins in the end won’t matter much, as that’s the man people want in their heart.
Any well-meaning citizen will stay away from dirty politics which pressurize certain candidates to withdraw while over-estimating the merits of others. Democracy is about providing fair chance, opportunity, to all and sundry, where the final result will be decided by the ballot of majority. No self-proclaimed political pundits, like Gyalkhab Rangzen and his mini-coterie, can contaminate the spring of democracy, crushing the heart of His Holiness into a zillion cold fragments.
kasur tashi wangdue for Deputy PM. LS for PM. His Hoiness the supreme leader. No useless hooligans around.
Old Monk,
A concerned citizen of Tibet
@sonam,293
And Sonam is the slave
For those who’re drugged by JN,
those who preserve Elite Relics,
And oppose the rise of commoners.
A blood-drop in the milk of the democracy.
Weed in the garden of civil society.
Old Man, did you listen to the radio link posted in #297? A huge crowd showed up for Tethong for such a small community and donation totaled up to $4000. That is LS home base. You sure he even won his own turf? interesting, isn’t it?
“Democracy is about providing fair chance, opportunity, to all and sundry”
no Old Monk, (practical) Democracy is simply an exercise of pandering to the lowest denominator.
The below was posted some minutes ago in the Phayul discussion forum:
RFA presents this informercial on candidacy of Lobsang Sangay. Man, the guy can dish out BS.
http://www.rfa.org/t…mp3/inline.html
LS just mentioned that all of his campaign expenses are paid by Harvard University in this interview. Does Harvard know that they are paying for his campaign for the election? What reasons would he be telling Harvard for his expenses and being away from his work for so long?
Isn’t this worrying?
http://www.rfa.org/t…mp3/inline.html
If LS says so, I would assume Havard is financing his campaign. Don’t we have any rules and regulations to avoid non-Tibetans involvement in our Kalon Tripa election?
LET US CALL HARWARD AND FIND OUT.
This place is infected by incurable
virus- 98%.
I have few GEORGE WASHINGTON to spare for anyone accepting charity.
TNT should produce his green book to verify he’s paid all his dues, and that he should explain his “deficit” case. LS did all that. what one animal does, the other animal should do…all animals are equal, some animals aren’t more equal than others.
we shouldn’t let TNT get away.
we’ll also pull every possible strings to get kasur TW sufficient votes. No easy game for TNT extremists.
Old monk @ 298
Its TW for Kalon Tripa and maybe LS for Kalon. Not the other way around. LS is very streetsmart, but he can learn some other good things from TW. He has potential no doubt but need proper direction. thank you.
A quick comparison of TW and TNT’s resumes reveal that TW is a standard issue loyal bureaucrat who has served the TGIE since 1966 at age 19. He left the service for 6 years on scholarship to study in England from 1968-1974.
TNT also joined TGIE at age 19 in 1967 as a translator. Quickly promoted as the Representative of the most important Dhonchoe in 1973 at age 25. His resume of founding number of the best known Tibetan institutions (Sheja, TYC, Tibet Fund, ICT, US Tibet Committee, etc.,) and heading the Tibetan delegation to Tibet and China suggest he is an entrepreneurial leader.
While both have very similar service duration, the two had very different career.
So if we want in a Katri someone who will loyally follow and serve, TW is the choice. If we want someone to lead and perhaps find own path without guidance, then TNT appear to be the choice. Both are important. The question is which of these two characteristics would we need in the next 10 years?
Both TNT (since 1967) and TW (since 1966) have greater experience working with the Tibetan cause than all the years LS has living as a Tibetan (born in 1968).
jinpa , khorlo left the race with respect from the masses.
gyari doma with solid 3000 votes left with dignity. do they not care about democracy and election? no, they DO! they just dont like to get involved with cheap indian politics.
but what is TWangdi doing with less than 2000 votes? just for the sake of bringing down a collegue he was jealous of for more than 40 years? !
very obvious, tall joker!
60,000 will vote in the final
100 votes for tashi wangdi
29,999 votes for tetong
30,001 votes for losang
old monk n daveno must be very happy for succeding in making a kid king!
but dont get too comfy!
TNT will go full throatle in the next 2 months n i dont wanna see you guys complaing suffocation!
i wont be there to do cpr on you! i will be in darjeling n boston going tripple penetration! full celebration!
A leader is somone who has the vision and boldness to lead and at the same time has creativity to find ways to create awareness and garner support from general public for the cause he’s leading. This is to say beside being honest and having integrity! Among the contestants for Katri election, no one else fits the bill more than TNT! LS may have lots of enthusiasm and ‘looks’ promising, but if you compare TNT with LS, the former is a man with proven track record whose creativity has not only furthered our cause but brought happiness and quality of life to many of us in exile. The latter despite bringing unprecedented energy into this election is still a candidate one might want to toss a coin!
Now one might aruge that future is in essence is no less than tossing a coin. I dare say we are not in that position to gamble given the critical time we are in…and also the luxury of choices we have in hand!
However, if this election was between LS and TW, I might not have been as sure about my candidate. TW may have super long years of service, actually much before the time LS was even born, but the man during the time never demonstrated enterprenurial skills or done something that impacted our lives or furthered our cause in the way TNT has. To me experience alone is not the criterion for leadership. As much as I respect TW for his service to the community, I might find myself inclined to gamble with LS to see if he could do what TW hasnt done.
However, with TNT in the race I can almost say there’s nothing to gamble! TNT has done and demonstrated all what a visionary leader is expected to do…and one just needs to see what more he has to do. However we must put him in the position of power to do that! So, lets elect TNT and give give him one more opportunity! With TNT it’s like walking in daylight with no worry of hitting a pitfall and stumbling…while with LS it’s like venturing out in the dark!
Sangay,
Good analysis.
Here is a quote from DG in a VOA post today.
“It has to be a leader who is not only good in governance, but who’s good in uniting the strength of the people inside and outside of Tibet, and taking them forward together,” says Gyari.
Hmmm… DG appears to be making a case for LS over TW.
i see a lot of insecurity in the tethong camp now that TW has made clear he will run. not to blame. After all, TW has a wide support base who have not participated in the preliminaries.
Only over a 30 000 took part in the preliminary. The total number of registered voters is a little over 70, 000. So there are lot TW supporters out there who will vote in the final.
Guys this is not your video game version of a race. this is tibetan in all respects. TW has been the tibetan candidate and he will prove it !!
Lhakpa,
TW has zero chance of winning this election. It is not nervousness but rather the deals that LS and TW appear to have been made facilitated by Juchen that is so annoying. While he has every right to be in the running, one really has to question his motive and that of those pushing him to run.
Daveno and Old Monk has openly suggested that TW should be in the race to give an edge to their candidate.
If TW ran of his own volition, then all the power to him.
दाल में कुछ काला है
TNT camp dwellers should know that aku Juchen isn’t a ‘constant’ in the equation of LS’s journey to premiership. Cooking cheap rumors might burn your own fingers, if not done wisely.
GYAKYAB RANGZEN MY FRIEND! @309
Those numbers are “TEMDREL SANGPO SHEY DRAK REY!.
Although i don’t agree with the number you have assigned to HOUNORABLE TASHI WANGDU LA,The most respected and trusted civil servant and Diplomat whose priority is always on “NATIONAL INTEREST”.
NYIMA LA @313,
Daveno and Oldmonk are just kids who look up to Tashi wangdu la and alike as role model.I am pretty sure, TW la has highly qualified advisor than us kids.
Dont spin & twist…you will get strangled!.
Nyima and supporters of TNT, I’m quite surpriesed that you guys can come up with such accusations agaisnt TW. But i guess the moral bankraptcy everywhere has you guys assuming all kinds of things. Juchen may be capable of something like that but TW doesnt seem like the sort to engage in laloo mayawati politics. If you reagrd TW so higly then why cant you accept him as a worthy candidate to run. For once suspend your paranoia about deals becoz there is no such deals i’m sure. Things are not always what they seem. things are more complicated than that.
It is hard to understand why Kasur Tashi Wangdi la is still in the race for Kalon Tripa and it is even harder to tell him not to run as it is his right to stand for the race. No doubt he is a great diplomat who has served our TGIE for a long time and I truly admire him for his service to our exile govt. but there comes a time, when one has to make a sound judgement for the sake of larger issue. Whether we like it or not, or whether we believe it or not, there is most likely some kind of pure politics is being played here now and we are seeing some very divisive natured activities within our own small community. Dolma Gyari la did what we all expected of her. She said at this time, she has no major support from the public and hence withdrawing her name from the race. Right observation but by withdrawing, it is LS who will most likely benefit the most. But atleast she wants to make it contest between the two top candidates. So, it is fair enough. But what can I say about TW la. His resignation from his post as Representative in Brussel, Belgium, which is a very important post is a shocking news to our Tibetan political disapora. He can serve better there and there are unfinished business there but he is entering into Kalon Tripa race simply as a political move to shift the balance between LS and TNT. We don`t need to explain, his entry into Kalon Tripa race will only help LS and hurt TNT and this fact Kasur TW la knows very well and he is doing this on purpose and not for the sake of our political process as claimed by his suppoters. Therefore, it is now even more harder to understand why TW la is doing this to all concerned Tibetans, when we have proven and visionary leader like TNT who can do a better job for the post of Kalon Tripa. Thank you Lobsang Jinpa la for all your dedication and you will always be our Kalon Tripa as you have always served His Holiness with utmost dedication and we thank you for your vision and support. TW la`s resignation from his post as Represenative in Belgium is a shocking wave to all of us and he has no realistic chance to win this election. The fact that he has roughly same votes as Dolma Gyari la clearly indicates that he and DG la are in the same boat and hence he should do the same. I atleast request him to resign with dignity from Katri race and there is no need to play pure politics and let the two leading candidates fight for the Katri race. Every body knows by staying in the race, you are indirectly endorsing LS la, who does not deserve to be Kalon Tripa at this critical juncture of political movement. Please just look and observe properly the age of our His Holiness and then we will get our answer. We need to make sure we have the right person as Kalon Tripa and there is no room for Mr. I and there is no room for playing pure politics and instead support Tenzin Namgyal Tethong la -your brother of service of dedication and we move forward with united force under the leadership of His Holiness. So, Thank you TW la.
It is not always about “WINNING”, especially when it relates to someone whose integrity is as high as mount everest.
It is more important to establish a sound democratic institution or practices for future citizen of the country than considering WINNING as the BE ALL and END ALL.
If i consider experiences as my first priority..i would have someone who is currently serving in TGIE with UP TO DATE experiences, RATHER THAN SOMEONE WHO HAD EXPERIENCES A DECADE AGO.
འོན་ཀྱང་དོན་དངོས་ཐོག་བཀྲས་དབང་མཆོག་ནི་བག་དང་ལྡན་ཞིང་བཟང་སྤྱོད་ལྡན་པའི་དབུ་འཁྲིད་གཅིག་ལོས་ཡིན་ བློ་སེང་གིས་ཟམ་གདོང་བླ་མས་ལད་ཟློས་བྱས་སྟེ་གསར་གཏོད་དང་ གཅིག་བསྒྲིལ་སོགས་ཚིག་རྐང་གསུམ་ཕྱིར་སྟོན་ཀྱང་ དེ་ནི་ཟློས་གར་ཙམ་ལས་ཁོང་གི་བརྒྱུད་ལ་ལྡན་པ་ཞིག་ག་ནས་ཡོང་ ཁོང་གི་ལི་ཐང་བརྟན་བཞུགས་སྐབས་དཔུང་བསྒྲིགས་སྟངས་དེ་ལ་བལྟས་ན་ཤེས་ཚོད་རེད་
བཀྲས་དབང་མཆོག་ལ་དེ་ལྟ་བུའི་ཡོན་ཏན་དང་ཉམས་མྱོང་ཞིག་ཡོད་ཀྱང་བོད་ཀྱི་ཡ་རབས་སྤྱོད་བཟང་མ་བརླག་པར་ཁ་སྐྱེངས་ ངོ་ཚ་ཁྲེལ་དང་ལྡན་པ་ཞིག་གནང་བ་རེད་
བསྟན་འཛིན་རྣམ་རྒྱལ་ནས་དེ་སྔ་བཀའ་བློནཁྲི་པ་ཐེངས་གཅིག་བྱས་ཚར་བ་དང་སྐབས་དེར་ཁོང་གིས་ལ་དགས་བལ་ལས་སོགས་ནས་དངུལ་མ་ཚང་བ་དང་དོན་དངོས་ཐོག་བོད་གཞུང་སྤང་སྒོག་བཟོས་པ་རེད་ གཞུང་གི་རྩིས་ཁྲ་བྱུང་སོང་ཁ་མ་འདུམ་པ་དེ་ཁོང་གིས་བྱས་རྗེས་ཞིག་ལོས་ཡིན་
སྔོན་འགྲོའི་འོས་གཞི་མ་བཏོན་གོང་སྤང་རྟགས་ཀྱི་མི་མང་ལ་འོས་ཤོག་སློང་མཁན་དེ་ཚོ་ཁྲིམས་དང་ལྡན་མིན་འོས་བསྡུ་འགན་འཛིན་འཇམ་དཔལ་ཆོས་བཟང་ལགས་ནས་གསལ་བཤད་ཞིག་གནང་རོགས་ཞུ་
སྔོན་འགྲོའི་སྐབས་འོས་བླུགས་མཁན་ཁྲི་གསུམ་བརྒལ་ཙམ་ལས་བྱུང་མེད་ དངོས་སུ་དེབ་སྐྱེལ་བྱ་མཁན་བདུན་ཁྲི་བརྒལ་བ་ཡོག་རེད་ དེ་ཚོ་ད་ལྟ་ཤི་ཡོག་མ་རེད་
Lakamen,
We are disappointed because it is so uncharacteristic of TW. By him staying in this race for political motivation, he is destroying his own credibility. If he is sincere in his support of LS, he should come out openly to support LS’ candidacy. I am sure he will be able to sway some votes. That would be the honourable way.
TW is a survivor and has done well working under most administration. It was interesting to watch SR push him off to make way for LNyandak. I thought that was unfortunate. So based on all this, I believe you are either being very naive or ignorant if you do not see the motive.
It is his every right to be in this election. As it is our right to know the deals if any. We have not seen a single statement directly from TW about his candidacy. Perhaps, it is LS’ supporters who are pushing all this without any consent from TW. That is possible as well.
Tashi Wangdi made a big sacrifice and a promising move to further the democratization process started by HH by resigning from his rep post in Europe. Now people like Sonam Topden are shuddering by the very thought of TW taking over the race.
Sonam Topden, for me, the shocking thing is TNT left his kalon post to look after his family in the US. Also govt was in deficit during his tenure, that is his achievement. His reputation is still questionable because of a piece in Mangtso newspaper written by none other than historian Tashi Tsering about 9 lacs rupees embezzled by TNT.
TW has a huge chance to win – now that he has officially declared his candidature. His actions are appropriate and according to the charter.
According to the charter, you can’t campaign before preliminary results are out. So it is only right that he should campaign now. Also he could not campaign actively while he is holding a public office.
So for me, LW and TNT have deserted the Tibetan masses long time back when they stayed back in the US. TW never abandoned his post for the last four decades.
There were 70 000 plus registered voters and only about 30, 000 voted. There are still 40, 000 plus undecided voters who will now vote for TW in the final.
Given the choice between LS and TNT, I would certainly go for LS. But LS is too young and novice for this job at a critical juncture like this. HH is retiring soon.
LS is reported asking for “Greater Tibet”, a term that includes all the provinces which were previously governed by nationalist China. This is problematic and may present a stumbling block to the dialogue process. TW supports HH wholeheartedly.
TW is the insider that every govt official in Dharamsala wants appointed. Nobody wants someone with no service record to give them orders in Dharamsala.
Yes, TW is an administrator and an effective one at that. He commands respect and leads by example – his service record.
So, Sonam Topden, I think next few months will be hard for you. You will countless sleepless nights to deal with.
TW issued a press release two days ago, of course in Tibetan. He is in the race and he will shock you guys. He is the underdog and he will pounce back like no other candidate.
look here : http://www.khabdha.org
“Out of the 79,449 registered voters, little over 47,000 (approximately 61%) voted in the preliminary polls conducted on October 3.”
Direct Quote from TPR report on the pre-lim results.
If the premise that Tashi Wangdi la in the running hurt’s Tethong la chances…then the thought that Tashi Wangdi la may have seen enough not to be impressed in the last 40 years to block Tethong la is plausible.
I dont understand how TNT supporters can be so arrogant and this sense of entitlement and demand TW to bow out for TNT.Why cant it be the other way round. and if you feel so strongly for the sake of tibet and tibetans as you say then is this the way to go about? baseless allegations after allegations in every comment from TNT supporters. And that directed agaisnt someone who commands the most respect and good will from all communites.
What has samdong rimpoche pushing him away to make way for Lnyandak got to do with this? If you’re suggesting that he is taking this opportunity to get back in D’sala then good for him.
Of course LS supporters are exploiting this situation and TNT camp totally falling for it.
PRESS RELEASE by Tashi Wangdi la
I, Tashi Wangdi have resigned from my post as the Representative of H. H.
The Dalai Lama in Brussels, Europe on December 17, 2010. I will be
contesting in the final elections of Kalon Tripa.
During the last couple of years, individuals and Non-governmental
organizations have continually asked me if I plan to be in the future
Kalon Tripa elections, and requested fervently that I do so. I have stated
that I have no such plans. Last year, Websites in Norway and Canada have
listed my name as a candidate for the 3rd Kalon Tripa and I have withdrawn
from them. Non-governmental organizations have similarly written to me
to stand for the election. However I replied both orally and in writing
that I have no such plans.
When the Election Commission announced my name with the
candidates winning in premliminaries, some concerned citizens
in the US, Europe and India have called me and
and told me that this is not the time to shirk from
responsibility and asked me if I would stand for the
elections if the voters elected me in the preliminaries.
I told them that my decision for not standing in the
preliminary elections was not because I got disheartened or
that I have no desire to serve and for that matter that
I am running away from challenges. I have served the
Tibetan government and people for over 40 years and
I thought if I would still be of help or not. That was
my reason for not standing in the elections. However, the larger
public has put great hopes and trust on me and
if they vote for me, I can not disregard their support. Therefore, I
agreed to stand if I am on the list of the candidates for the
final election. On November 12, 2010, Election Commission
announced the candidates for the final election and
I presented my resignation from the Brussels Representative
office to the Kashag. I hope to be participating in media
interviews, debates, and conferences in the 3 months
until the final election and I hope general
public will have a chance to know more about my
stand on the movement and the administrative
policies. During this time period, I won’t be able
to travel to Tibetan settlements because of
time and financial constrainsts. But it does not mean
I underestimate the election process and the electorate.
As we all know, Kashag has to implement the policies and
procedures legislated by the Tibetan parliament according to
the charter. As for me, I have climbed the ladders of
administration in serving the Tibetan government and people
for the last 40 years and the general public are aware
of that. However, youngsters and newcomers from Tibet in the last
two decades may not know clearly and that is a reality. As our
community is not that big, it might help by
enquiring and researching on all aspects of my credentials
and to see if I am a viable candidate for the Kalon
Tripa position.
Under the leadership of H.H. The Dalai Lama and with the
welfare of the 6 million Tibetans in mind, I hope to
cement the organizations and disciplines we have established
and to sustain and improve them, and to handover them
to the new generation in a calm and smooth transition. These
would be my commitmment for the five years. Tashi Wangdi. December 21, 2010.
TNT should withdraw to make way for kasur tashi wangdi la. tw is a man of proven calibre.
85% of TGiE civil servant vote goes to Tashi wangdu la.
Success! Old Monk has abandoned his man to support TW. That is progress. We are coming closer now.
Now that TW is officially in the race, I welcome him and look forward to seeing his campaign. I hope he is not saying that he is in the race but that we should not expect to see him campaigning because of “cost and time”.
I am willing to bet with anyone that if LS wins, expect to see TW in the Kashag.
TW is a loyal public servant but not a leader. I am still sticking with my guy, TNT!
Daveno, are you also abandoning LS to move to TW?
Drokpo Nyima la,
Oldmonk and Daveno may be naive but they are very honest in their comment about all candidates.
Daveno,
Now you are speaking for Oldmonk. 🙂 So, have you switched your support to TW? Naive or not, I am happy to hear that you believe what you say is the truth. There are many who continue to believe the earth is flat, and that a big fish is responsible for the earthquakes. They are also being honest. That does mean they are correct.
I hope you are not suggesting that somehow the “other side” is not honest. Most of what is being discussed are opinions and deductions based on certain facts. That happens all the time. Conclusions are derived based on various known inputs. Much of these analytical deduction skills are perfected by the Buddhist scholars.
Let me quote a very smart man who once said … “If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, looks like a duck, it must be a duck” And I hear you saying … probably not. We are calling it as we see it.
Jampa la,
Kasur TW la is a great diplomat but there is a huge difference between a diplomat and a proven visionary leader with proven accomplishment like Kasur TNT. We want leader with proven accomplishments. Regarding your comment on deficit issue, you need to update your information first. There is a official circulation from TGIE just recently, clarifying and supporting Kasur TNT. You need to read it first before you accuse someone. This very support clarification justifies the truth and support from TGIE. Moreover, TNT himself clarifies this deficit issue during his talk and debate in the past. so, please check your fact first. TNT served our TGIE for 30 years and after completing his kalon term, he then only resign for personal reason. However, he has continously worked for the cause of Tibet for the last 15 years and Jampa la, you can check the facts.
the reasons why i dont support LS:
1. he sincerely does not believe in struggling for independence–a national goal without realising which we have no hope as a people, culture n nation)
2. he does not support party or bi-party system which would include Tibetans from different provinces and sects in both the parties thereby reducing negative regionalism(i am all for positive regionalism) and sectarianism to a great extent with people paying more attention to ideological wisdom, goals, policies and differences.
3. he does not believe in the importance of Separation of religion from politics which would reduce destructive religious influences on political decisions. mixing religion with politics increases sectarianism which plagued us since 7th century ad)
4. he does not support One person one vote system. this decision of his tells us what a destructive regional force he is. Very undemocratic.
5. he does not believe in the need for Opposition party(to correct when ruling party errs. Power check and balance besides the 3 pillars n press)
6. he does not support population n residence based voting n representation system in chithuetrotsok. another pointer that he is regionalistic. listen to rfa n how he evaded this fair democratic process by misleading public with wtf is going on in american senate with 2 seats per state. wyoming with less than 1 million has only 1 chithue seat n california with 37 million has 53 chithue seats. this he never mentioned even.
7. all day long he has been saying UNITY n when it comes to taking a neutral stand he instead screamed LITHANG PUNGDRIK several times at dhasa meeting! lithang pungdrik against whom? against utsangs or against amdos? where is the big unity here? there you go boy!
8. NO TO provincial AND SECTARIAN REPRESENTATION politics!
yes to secular bi-party democracy working for independence!
@Nyima,
My loyalty is grounded and will not shake.
You can cut my top half,but the loyalty will remain strong and will grow.
Sonam Topden la, I don’t really think Tenzin Namgyal la is a visionary leader. You sound like a evalengist by selling this idea to me. I know exactly who is TNT and I don’t think he has a vision like TW. TW has a vision to serve the people. He has never wavered from that commitment. Unlike TNT, who deserted his post of Kalon to immigrate to the US.
TW is easily the favourite of NGOs like Utsang, NDPT…except that he decided to be humble. We can clearly see the humility of a dignified man.
The campaigns before the preliminaries – sparked off by Thupten Samdup la’s website is in fact a unlawful act according to the charter.
Unlike you, I know the facts inside out and the Kashag’s letter says there was a deficit in the TGIE’s budget during his tenure. It speaks for itself. He should have resigned at that very moment.
But it does explain “Chelak” – which means shortage or missing funds. The correct Tibetan word for deficit is “jung song Kha ma-dhumpa”. You guys can fool some people at some times and not all people at all times. What do you say about the article b Tashi Tsering in Mangtso about about “Boom Gu” – nine lacs embezzlement. Give me a break now.
correction on first line last para:
“But it does NOT explain chelak…..”
I haven’t seen Green book payment document by TNT and his wife.
Also his IC document. I hear you guys say he was in the negotiation team…i want to see he got visa on IC. or does he have IC at all.
we need the actual copy of the newspaper, Mangtso, scanned for public view in forums like TPR where we can read it ourselves. Tashing Tsering scholar of reliable moral authority, and we need to take the case very serious. TNT’s alleged embezzlement case is very fishy, and hides a very dangerous black skeleton.
An observation by someone who attended TNT toronto visit…
‘In his latest Toronto presentation, he seemed rather evasive-ambiguous-too tactful- or felt rather compelled to answer for the sake of answering- in response to some of the clear cut questions from the audience.’
I guess many pieces on TPR should be put into ‘Fiction’ category.
a copy of mangtso can only be found in Dharamsala at the LTWA or at AMI. Someone can make a copy of that easily.
Dear Jampa and Tsering darling,
If you truly support your candidate TW la, then I will respect you because TW la has served our TGIE for a very long time with dedication and he is thousand times better than LS la. Indeed your candidate is also a Kalon Tripa material. But as I said I support TNT la because he is the only Tibetan in exile who has incredible record of accomplishments and achievments and you need to look back and do some research. By the way, enjoy LS supporter because this is exactly what you guys looking for. Regarding budget deficit issue, do you think that our Kalon Tripas can misuse our budget as of their wishes, this is simply ridiculous. If you are so concern then why don`t you contact Jamyang Norbu la, Tashi Tsering la and other members of editors of Mangtso Newspaper, all are still alive and healthy and you all know how to contact them. Tibetan public are not foolish that we can fool them. Please don`t undermine our public and instead check your facts. You have every right to support your candidate but don`t criticize our candidate based on false allegations. Oh darling, this much for now and Merry Christmas!
Merry Christmas to those who celebrate it and happy holidays to those who don’t. I am making extra copies of Tethong: Life in Exile as we quickly ran out of the 300 copies. Each time people watch that video, they realize how such a rate gem exists in our midst and they become converts. I am just thrilled as to what it can do in the settlements where people appreciate hard work and dedication. We are sending out 3000 copies all over Tibetan settlements and encouraging all friends of Tenzin Namgyal Tethong to make extra copies. Old Monk and Daveno, if you guys like copies, please shoot me an email. As they say in Tibetan, “Even if the gold is hidden in the ground, its glow will fan the sky”. Bye bye now. 🙂
@Tendhar!
Good job. now we dont have to do anything.
After seeing TNT in dvd,people will say-Thank goodness we didn’t vote for him.
TW la is a Diamond if your TNT is a gold.
And LS platinum!
Jamyang Norbu a bronze!
if LS is platinum, TNT is uranium! LS asses will be blown apart to shreds n horses on my side will go “ki ahang! ki ahang!”
Grangzen, looks like “Basement rangzen’ era is on the rise..with ki-ahang!
Bir Chauntra (Nangchen Div.), Bir, H.P. | for more »
Bir Dege, Bir, Himachal Pradesh | for more »
Bir Tibetan Society, Bir, H.P. | for more »
Bomdila, Arunachal Pradesh | for more »
Choephelling, Miao, A.P. | for more »
Dalhousie, Chamba, H.P. | for more »
Darjeeling, West Bengal | for more »
Dekyiling, Dehradun, U.A. | for more »
Dharamsala, Himachal Pradesh | for more »
Dhargayling, Tezu, A.P. | for more »
Dhondenling, Kollegal, K.S. | for more »
Dhondupling, Clementown, U.A. | for more »
Dickyi Larsoe, Bylakuppe, K.S. | for more »
Doeguling, Mundgod, K.S. | for more »
Doeguyougyelling, Herbertpur, U.A. | for more »
Gangtok, Sikkim | for more »
Gapa Tibetan Society, Kumrao, H.P. | for more »
Kalimpong, West Bengal | for more »
Kham Khatok, Sataun, H.P. | for more »
Kunphenling, Ravangla, Sikkim | for more »
Lingtsang, Munduwala, U.A. | for more »
Lugsung Samdupling, Bylakuppe, K.S. | for more »
Norgayling, Bandhara, Maharashtra | for more »
Palrabling, Kullu/Manali, H.P. | for more »
Paonta Choelsum, Paonta Sahib, H.P. | for more »
Phendeling, Mainpat, Chattisgarh | for more »
Phuntsokling, Gajapati, Orissa | for more »
Rabgayling, Hunsur, K.S. | for more »
Sakya Tibetan Society, Puruwala, H.P. | for more »
Samyeling, Majnu-ka-tilla, Delhi | for more »
Shillong, Mehgalaya | for more »
Sonamling, Ladakh, J. & K. | for more »
Tashijong, Bir, Himachal Pradesh | for more »
Tashiling Tibetan Camp, Pandoh, H.P. | for more »
Tashiling, Sonada, West Bengal | for more »
Tenzingang, Bomdila, A.P. | for more »
Tibetan Bonpo Foundation, Dolanji, H.P. | for more »
Tuting, Arunachal Pradesh | for more »
Yangchen Gatselling, Shimla, H.P. | for more »
DOOR TO DOOR DISTRIBUTION OF LEAFLETS & DVDs(in plastic bags like we do with “tsok”) must be done if we are to win. 2 guys on motorbike can finish 1 settlement per day. very very easy. cost 10 lac maximum for campaign materials. i m sure we have at least 10 supporters in each settlement to do it. if materials are ready tibetan world could be covered in one week. many voters in india cant remember lobsang sangay any more. 2 years ago story. total memory collapse!time to alter the remaining few stupid minds!
thanks for enlightning us about current kalon tripa candidature.we as tibetans really need someone who is capable of putting leadership of H.H. The Dalai Lama ‘s words on future of tibet into action.The one who doesnot waste precious time not in reinventing new strategy but move on with full faith what is there already guided by our God King.He is one of the best leaders we have now and we need doer not bluffer
who you think will serve this purpose for six million tibetans.on one hand communist leaders are trying their best to divide us on the basis of provinces,religion,and ect.and we need someone whom majority of tibetans trust and unite as one and whom we look up as staunch followers of our God king the compassionate bodhisattva.please respond.i am neutral at present
for the sake of Daveno and Old Monk (LosWangyal), I am gonna root for Tashi WAngdu la– but only fromm certain people.
I request all the monks to vote for TW. LosWangyal and Daveno and the rest of the LS supporters who highly thinks of TW, please vote for TW. O.K?
YOurs Agu
Boston people says LS never get involved with community event until few years ago. Once he started to come in, he wants to youth to from various groups and organizations and he wants to sit in as an advisors. One of them said, ” we have no idea he was, in fact, trying to build his poor resume.
At Harvard, one of my friends room mate knows LS and said, LS was clever but not smart. Many of his writings and ideas are purely plagiarize. He has many information but often not came out of his research.
I told that Boston Friend of Mine, how can you expect more from a Mediocre person who was on the waiting list during his full bright entrance test. LS supporters says he is a self-made man. R U kidding me?
Thats a disgrace to Athar Norbu and Dr. Tenzin Choedrak. Athar supported his education in India, and Dr. Tenzin Choedark put him in the best university although he was the last person on the scholarship list (The orders are placed from top performer to bottom: he just happen to get in with the disqualification due to eligibility issue).
U make decision whether he is a self made or Athar Dr. Choedrak made.
Yours agu.
Am I now supposed to look for a much harder ore or something while you two giggle and wait for my answer in your mother’s basement? In your Tarzan underwears of course.
He/Daveno/Old Monk looks down the tarzen underwear for his missing Indian cookie! The Gadhi Indian or is it south Indian neighbor jumped in n created him while his mom’s tehor old man failed her carnal urges repeatedly! Narcisist at its height!
Ya right! I feel like i am still in junior high while reading your comments.
#349 Tashi Nyima are you suggesting that Tibetans only use their faith in HH Dalai Lama as a means to gain independence? That any other good Tibetans that have ideas regarding independence should not be heard? This sounds like you would return Tibet back to an old caste style of government. I have faith in the Dalai Lama as Chenrezig but Tibetans need to utikize the ideas of all Tibetans not a dictatorship.
Tendhar@, You have the reached the first stage…and you bought that..he he!
G-rangzen, Empty vessel sounds louder!
no.355
the gentleman who shared his valueable views on tibets struggle to find a perfect kalon tripa in march 2011 who have so much responsibility to shoulder in giving direction to future of tibet.i appreciate it.but i want to add that H.H.The Dalai Lama has accepted one country with two system and theres no question of independence for tibet at present though nobody can rewrite the history of more than thousand years of independent tibet approved by world lawyers.but the impasse in the negociation cropped up due to communist unwilling to give autonomy to three provinces of tibet under one administration.
moreover,tibet before the illegal occupation of coomunist party was not so babarous as you picturise it in your head by reading communist chinese propaganda.it was peaceful religious loving surrounded by virgin environment.ok
And i have full faith in middle path approach coined by HH Dalai Lama and approved by majjority of tibetans in democratic voting ok
It is certainly your democratic right to have full faith in middle path but could you be kind enough to come up with evidence to support your belief?
Tashi Nyima #357 I admire your’s and all Tibetan’s faith in the middle path. However, Tibet should not limit itself to the ideology of one party or one path. The vision of HH is only one vision. If Tibet wants to embrace Democracy then embrace it fully. Do not give democracy lip service. In a democracy all officials will be elected by the people which does not make acceptions for Tibet’s previous feudal or monastic systems. It sounds as if you would prefer to have Tibet return to that kind of system…am I right? Maybe that type of system worked well in Tibet for that time in history. Maybe it was the “Shangri La” you describe. Unfortunately, today’s nations will not accept that sort of system and Tibet would suffer for it.
It will be promising to have fully functioning democratic system.But every system has it own limitation.
Numbers do not matter in the path, if the path chosen is the best possible solution for that time period. Does not necessarily mean that the path cannot be changed.
Embracing a part or full does not matter, what works best for the people at the time counts.
Blind faith attitude died 20 years ago.Every move are subjected to scrutiny currently.
LS ‘s shadow cabinet is wikileaked. People in Manju-ka-tila are talking about following person as being talked about in LS cabinet. Pema Chonjor security minister. Thupten Lungrig stays on as education minister, ( as a reward for Fullbright waiver and also a answer for continuity of SR’s Kashag), Chime Youngdrung of Mansto stokpa, deputy minister for Information and International Relations,Youdon Aukatsang, Youth empowerment,Kushok Bagdro as deputy kalon for religious affairs;Lobsang Wangyal as minister for (dis)information and technology, Dr.Sonam Topgyal (ST) as minister for Health.
i saw somewhere that ‘Tibetans has traveled 500yrs in 5decades’, I found it very true the transformation is so drastic, unfortunately few people are carried away by some misconception and foolish to compare our exile govt. with other independent countries.
it is true that we need clean democracy, but the question is are we capable to perform in an effective way. our illusion may be clear by seeing the performance of chithues not only this batch but before. matter is not about argument but the matter on which we are fighting.
real democracy should come from people, our population is most concentrated at shichak. So, in shichak elder people have concern about Tibet cause but lacks education, younger have slight education but least concern.
yes we have transformed alot but we have all the provincial potential to tear apart Tibet in the name of ChoelkaChoeluk. lest the possibility of worse case scenario, we should have unified leader, and we already have one the HHDL.
now it is in our hand whether to make our exile community vulnerable to virus or not.
1. does LS have just 1 day of work experience in tgie?
2. on what document did he travel to china? ic or chinese
passport? is he not a green card holder? is he not married to usa citizen/greencard holder?
3. why didnt LS win no more than a handful of votes in his hometowns like darjeling n boston? what does this prove? lack of team work/spirit? lack of integrity?
4. what does he mean by “lithang pungdik!” at dhasa meeting? very disturbing. does it not show he is very negatively regionalistic?
5. service waiver? is it not favoritism? regionalism?
6. what is his campaign fund source? disclose! no harvard bull. may have spent upto $30 grand in the past 2 years on travels, hall rents, pamphlets, posters, taxis, websites, lodgings etc.
8. coming to ari for cause–an outright lie! we all come here for ouselves 90%. nothing wrong in that. but pliz no lies! his credibility at stake!
9. his connection with juchen- utsang hater! my personal experience with juchen in kashag in 1988.
10. why did he desert tyc in midway for old chushigangdruk in 1992!
11. what is his work history if any?
12. why did it take him 7 years to complete his short thesis? does this show he is a good writer?
13. why is his thesis not published? what does this tell us about the quality of his work? prof. dawa norbu n prof. tsering shakya’s got published!
14. he was on fulbright waiting list. what does this say? mediocre student?
15. sjd supported by tsg, not harvard. does it ring anything?
16. why is he hated in his hometowns darjeling, boston? by people who have known him since his childhood? unreliable character?
17. greenbook lumsum payment(jobless category). if this is not true, prove it by providing the copies of all the pages from 1999 to 2010 on his fb account or on phayul forum. no statement crap from tgie. thanks.
18. only similarity between him n obama–same law school.
rest disimilarities!
20. his writings despite going through 10 editors is nowhere near jamyang norbu’s. why? very poor quality. shames harvard!
21. his supporters resorting to hooliganism in bylakuppe. what does he have to say on this? is violence your means to get katri? why are you so silent on this?
22. arrogant–thinks he can fly planes just by reading a book.
25. why is he so weak in literary tibetan? he can hardly read n write in tibetan. wonder how he will understand the announcements, circulars n chithue resolutions in tibetan language!
26. most people finish phd thesis by 27. he finished it at 40!
27. why are all shugdhen follwers supporting him?
28. why is cpc supporting him to win? fishy?
29. why did he let his supporters bribe nepali police to seize the ballot boxes? is he that insecure?
30. why didnt he respond to the tpr questions? very iresponsible?
31. why is he always stealing credits from others’ work?
32. why is always stealing other people’s researches?
33. what will he do when he loses this election, knowing he is getting laid of from harvard next year for not being able to produce his more than 8 short reasearch writings in the last 6 years? !34. you guys say change. what is it really? change of face? change of ideas? what fresh ideas? pliz concretize here at least in words. saying she is beautiful is not as same as proving her having golden breasts, rosy lips and supple butts!
happy new year 2011! luv you all my countrymen!
LS is the rising sun of change. An epitome of progress. samdhong is great, tethong is great…but none is as great as Dr. LS. His vision,dynamism,youthfulness,wit,integrity,sophistication.
Tethong campaigners are resorting to vandalism of electorate ethics, hurting baseless accusations like ” why did he bribe nepal police to seize ballots?”, which are stark indicators of their lack of moral values,bad family upbringing,and to a large extent, sheer desperation.
In this blood-thirsty political battlefield, LS is a rare warrior who clings to his values, beliefs,and integrity, and maintain a dignified silence, even at the face of most blatant of malicious abuses. He’s proved his broad-mindedness right in front of our eyes. We need him before the nation’s final demise into ashes.
BTW folks, what we just heard on comment # 364 is Lobsang Sangay propaganda blared from one of his two loudspeakers. And FYI, several similar loudspeakers are also placed all over Tibetan settlements in India and monasteries that play similar Lobsang Sangay propaganda all through day and night. So, if you happened to be in India and heard something to this effect: Lobsang Sangay is savior; he’s better than Tenzin Tethong blah blah blah….think of those times in 60’s in China when songs and monologues bombarded from all four sides in an effort to brainwash the masses in an effort to make them believe something that’s actually contrary to it in reality.
I know it does seem like we are in Cultural Revolution era, thanks to Lobsang Sangay’s tacit support to, and his Red Guards-like gung-ho supporters use of stomach-churning rhetoric to praise and equate him to almost the Sun. World maybe moving ahead with more and more sophisticated ways of campaigning such as debate; proving right from wrong through production of evidence; answering questions and thus dissipating public doubts and accusations; transparency and so forth. But in Tibetan politics, none of these are happening in the name of “dignified silence”. We Tibetans seem to be going back instead of forward! I dont know who to blame for this backward transition: either we public must have manifested signs that we are utter dumb, that anything one rams it down our throat we will swallow. Or these LS’s internet ‘red guards’ are insulting our intelligence!
And interesting enough, in the comment #363 there are over 30 questions for Losbang Sangay, but his chief propagandist Old Monk has something to say about only one of them! Bring it on guys. The ground is still covered with snow, flu hasn’t left my body entirely, so going out and having fun is as bad an idea as electing LS over TNT. So write more, so i can have laugh and kill my time!
BTW, let me leave you all with two sound bites that are similar in tone -one that played in 60s in China, and the other we heard through LS loudspeaker at #364:
“Mother may be close, father may be close but neither is as close as chaiman Mao”.
“Tethong is great, Samdhong is great but neither is as great as Dr LS”
@Sangay,
“Tethong is great, Samdhong is great but neither is as great as Dr LS”
I WOULD REPLACE YOURS TO
“Tethong is not so good, Tashi wangdi is good but neither are great as Dr LS”
No one can stand close to Peldhen Khewang Samdhong Rinpoche.
daveno, are you dumbfounded by the glaring naked facts that prove LS a third class political mercenary!
@Vote..
LS la is the Next Kalon Tripa.
i am and my huge no. of friends going to support ls in the coming election but vote your point no. 27 make us uncomfortable.
H.H.The Dalai Lama democratic govt. in exile has been loved and supported in whole world incl(chinese people)except communist party leaders.Because it is based on truth and love to all e.g middle way path if accepted by communist leaders will enhanced fraternity and peace among han and tibetans.thats why, many chinese are supporting middle way path themselves.if there is freedom of press in china then i am sure 90 percent will support middle way apprach because it benefits not only tibetans but also chinese and the world world.it is splendid thing only boddhisatva can churn out such peaceful way.
response to one of the readers
Tashi Nyima, you are beautifully naive…
98% of chinese citizens as well as officials support their communist party from the depth of their heart. ( check wikileaks cables!) what we hear about chinese public admiring Tibetans is baseless joke–what’s the evidence? Any reference? According to what source?
Tibetans are strange breed of race, genetically dumb, with minimal power of analysis and judgement. If this nation of Tibet disappear within 30 years, i won’t be surprised…they’ve no survival skills at all, way too blunt, naive, and assuming to a pathetic extent.
Survival alone is not enough. We are no dog’s n cats. Survival of body but most important survival of pedigree of us – culture, tradition, history language etc important. First step to this survival is knowing who we are, how we are different from other species and then preserving those distinguishing characteristics from extinction. The best way to keep all these intact and thriving is to have a place of our own, or RANGZEN!!!!!!!!!!
Now putting this in the context of Katri election 2011, Lobsang Sangay wants and envisions future Tibet as a part of china with Tibetans being a member of big family of motherland China where Tibetans, chinese live together and enjoy equal political right to become president of China!
Old monk if you are concerned with survival of Tibetan people and nation as you seemed to be, one doesn’t need to be anthropologist or sociologist to see Lobsang Sangay is leading us to extinction, and in 30 years maybe totally as u say! Tenzin Tethong wants to give Middleway a chance reason being it’s His Holiness’s policy but said he’s gonna reconsider it should China make fool of us again in the name of ‘talk’ or majority of Tibetans demand it. Given that Tibetan are different from Chinese historically, ethnically, culturally, linguistically, nationally etc he said he personally supports right to self-determination for us. Now this approach is towards the ‘survival’ of Tibetan people as opposed to Lobsang Sangay’s total assimilation with chinese people.
So, the choice is clear here. You just need to be true to yourself. Lobsang Sangay leads you to Beijing, Tenzin Tethong to Lhasa. Or if u still insist on Lobsang Sangay, then there are two possible causes – either you are brazenly disingenuous or you dislike Tethong to the detriment of 6 million tib people!
LS la is a great patriot. He has been in USA for the last 15 years for the sake of our cause. This was his own claim. He knows inside and outside of Tibet, everything. Again it was his claim. He kept IC so that oneday he will return to serve our TGIE, again claim by his supporters. He responded to his IC claim with Indian visa proving he has IC but we all know his wife is a green card holder. so, its not a big deal that he still carries his IC. There lies political ambition behind this logic.
However, how did he get his Chinese visa on his IC? is the issue of interest. Since LS la is a man of great integrity and believer of transparent demoratic values, he will show us his Chinese visa on his IC on TPR and I am sure he will not let us down because defeat is not in his dictionary.
Tibetan by nature are bit lazy ( HHDL confirmed in montreal). This is mainly the cause of inequality in Tibet..i guess.
“”Vote for Jola dhundup..he is great..rey dha rey dha..dhey ka rang rey. I hear this everytime there is chitue voting or camp jagpon voting time.”
We will not let others use this innocent believing nature to their advantage in this kalon tripa race.
We will educate the mass and we will make them think and think better.
People in Dharamsala are shocked to hear LS say on Tibetan radio broadcast that Harvard University is funding his election campaign. Everyone is asking what is Harvard University’s interest here? This is no hearsay. It is statement of fact. Recording of his claim on radio is doing round. Look for it yourself.
Now here is an opening for TNT people to ask Harvard University provide Tibetan people with an answer. LS thinks that no Tibetans will ever dare ask Harvard University.
The story of rise of Obama is described as Audacity of Hope, but more and more we listen to LS’s story is “Audacity of lies.”
People in US should nail him on his claim of Harvard funding his campaign. Although, I live in Manju-ka-tila, I know that there is no history of any university funding political campaigns for any government.
LS keep changing his funding story. It is sounding very fishy.
I sincerely wish Tibetan Political Review contact Harvard University and get the fact behind LS’s claim that the university is funding his Katri election, and if yes, why. This will be in the interest of Tibetan people and fairness in our democracy for which we would be thankful!
I heard LS say that his airfare were paid by Harvard for his talk on subject that he is considered expert by HU.
This is not a campaign financing, its financing for his talk in India and at the ASIA YOUNG LEADER meeting.
BTW..have you got invited to talk at any LEADERSHIP..young or old…phewww!
Sonam la
you seem to know something a lot.would you care to share
i feel that things have changed since the tianamein square masacre in china and the world picture of communist party policy aftermath of that tragic event.
hail to ls for being one of the most educated and interested in our cause among the young genration at a time when most young minds are diverted elsewhere especially in tibet under chinese rule distract our young able man and woman by making available entrainment like karroke ,bars ,etc easily accessible.
and Hail to tn for sacrificing his prime time of his life serving our community at the hour of need when there arent much english speaking genre around.
the reasons why i support TNT:
1. he sincerely believes in struggling for independence–a national goal without realizing which we have no hope as a people, culture n nation)
2. he supports party or bi-party system which would include Tibetans from different provinces and sects in both the parties thereby reducing negative regionalism(i am all for positive regionalism) and sectarianism to a great extent with people paying more attention to ideological wisdom, goals, policies and differences.
3. he does believe in the importance of Separation of religion from politics which would reduce destructive religious influences on political decisions. mixing religion with politics increases sectarianism which plagued us since 7th century ad)
4. he does support One person one vote system. this decision of his tells us what a uniting force he is. Very fair n democratic.
5. he does believe in the need for Opposition party(to correct when ruling party errs. Power check and balance besides the 3 pillars n press)
6. he does support population/residence based voting/representation system in chithuetrotsok. another pointer that he is fair n democratic.
7. all his life he has been a symbol of UNITY, innovation, self-reliance, experience, integrity and vision!
8. NO TO provincial AND SECTARIAN REPRESENTATION politics!
9. yes to tibetan pungdrik against chinese occupyers!
10. yes to secular bi-party democracy working for independence!
CAN WE TRUST LS?
He lies all the time. Thats why they are many follow up questions from the answers he provided to the the first one. Just because he provided IC copies to TPR doesn’t mean other candidates to do the same. AFter all who made the IC issue? He himself did as he said, ” I always travel on IC.” We know why he said that. But it backfired him when the news of his visit to China surfaced. So naturally, there was this question, “HOW DID YOU GET CHINESE VISA ON IC?
INSTEAD of answering on this issue, he answered by providing copies of IC with indian visa. We are not interested in that part. LET ME REPEAT, HOW DID YOU GET YOUR CHINESE VISA ON IC? You can fool the people in India with your flowery talk but not us.
I still have valid Indian IC, renewed few months before i became CItizen of this counrty. And remember, with green card you can easily travel on IC. AS A MATTER OF FACT, LS CHOSE TO KEEP IC BECAUSE HE DOESN’T WANT TO PAY THE VISA FEE AND WE GET GRATIS VISA ON IC… THAT MEANS NO FEES.
THIS ISSUE PERTAINS TO LS ONLY AND HE INVITED IT BY MISTAKE AND WE MUST SCRUTINISE. AS A SAYING GOES, ” ZUN KI THAMA CHAK YIN KYANG DHOS” PLEASE TRANSLATE, TENPA LA IF YOU CAN.
Have a wonderful New year 2011 and victory to TNT or TW (as Daveno and old monk wishes).
Yours Agu
Agu,
Repeating a question again and again makes it clear that you are one dump-headed kid to teach.
Record the Clarification by LS and play it again and again or whenever you have that question in your “GHODHA GURU” brain.
We dont WISH,PRAY and DREAM. We dont need luck also with the leadership qualities that LS possess.
DAVENO, unless you are LS yourself or his family,
You are sick. You are here with a a very specific mission. I have a test for you. Just ask your maha-guru LS to come out clean on his behind the scene dealings with Agu Juchen Thupten.
The latest report is that Juchen has made LS swear that if he wins, he will not bring both the present Chithue Tsoksto Penpa Tsering and Tsokshon Gyari Dolma into his govt. People close to Agu Juchen say, he hates the guts of these two people. It is said initially Agu Juchen is also not very ga ga about LS himself too, but after Pema Jongjor’s intervention, things have reported to have changed.
Agu Juchen is reported to have thrust his importance to LS by lecturing him about possible slips between cups and lip, especially when he is this close to katri position, that Juchen himself can play a real spoiler.
So underneath instructions are said to be already on, like that one went for seeking support for Karma Chophel from religious groups.
My sources are solid. But as buddha said, don’t believe any of the things said here. Seek your own information and connect the dot as as things begin to appear,and simply watch the fate of the players mentioned here as we move forward.
I represent a silent majority who just skim what is being discussed and leave. I could never have jumped in here. But Daveno and some of LS ‘s supporters of attitude of LS is “holier than thou” forces me to puke.
I due suspect some of these could be just disguising themselves as LS supporters and trying to hurt him from within, by praising him sky-high.
But if they are his genuine supporters, they should know that LS is nothing but a very smooth lier. It might have worked in his personal life and brought wealth and fame, but it will be not work in pursuit of national cause. Our more sophisticated enemy will shoot us into tatters. Is he a good Tibetan ? Yes. But then so is, Machen Chemo -la of Gangkyi staff mess. LS is simply not the right man for the post of Kalon Tripa.
Daveno and LS supporters, if you don’t like TNT, don’t vote for him, but at least take a double look at TW and contemplate over TW’s candidature before you regret casting your precious vote to a wrong man.
Deveno, I know you will say you are entitled to your opinion, but you are also entitled to my ideas. You are most welcome.
@LB,
I am fine..dont worry!
I go with my own analytical result on any decision i make.
I believe all LS supporters are very well aware of who they have chosen to support and elect and follow.
I might consider idea here and there as my PHAGHEN would say”Droe mee dhang jee, thak rang ghee choe”.
I will use your above logical reasoning in the
areas that i will see fit to use.
i am glad to be here in this group for many reasons one of which is obviously your support for TNT. a daveno here or demo there shouldnt bother us so much. however, if you dont mind i like to have your yes or no answer to my specific questions here. i very much appreciate your response. it means a lot to me.
1. independence?
2. multi party or bi-party system?
3. Separation of religion from politics or abolishing the current cholog seats?
4. One person one vote system?
5. Opposition party?
6. population/residence based voting/representation system in lower house?
7. equal provincial representation in upper house?
I want to thank NYNJ Tibetan community for hosting Kalon Tripa debate and it was watched with great interest from all over the world, wherever there is Tibetans. This debate has served its purpose by engaging people and letting them know more about each candidates policies, plans and their ideas how to lead us. It was clear after the debate that both the Kasurs did better job than LS. They proved it through their political maturity and long service record with TGIE. They both are more genuine and trustworthy and thus proved worthy of being kalon tripa. On the other hand LS is over negative and lacks respect to both the kasurs with his response and strange examples. We know its a debate, but LS approached in a negative manner with his style of argument. That reflects poor on his character. To prove his popularity he stated very clearly in VOA Kueling interview that he has support letter from Boston community. However it was signed by some 50 members of Boston and even these names are now being questioned in Boston. Where as Boston Tibetan Community never endorsed any candidate. When asked about this issue, he again gave some lame answer and it proved he is not the right man to lead us as he is not trustworthy. When asked about one man one vote system, LS answered in legal perspective. In simple terms, he does not support one man one vote system, which is one of the fundamental criteria for fair election process in any democracy. The reason is simple because his vote bank is those big monastic institutions in our settlements, where one monk voting twice for same candidate was carried out on large scale during the pre-election. So, this election is not a fair election based on democratic principles. Sadly Kasur TW la’s response to the same issue was highly political and he is not responding according to the fact. It was only Kasur TNT la gave the most logical answer by supporting one man one vote system, which is in accordance to the highest principles of democracy. The way TNT handled age question was also very accurate and I admire him for that. TW chose not to answer and that was interesting. We all know LS is good in talk and his big talk will work in Tibetan settlements in India but he cant get away when try to be over smart here in North America or in the West. Because people have now become more aware of our candidates. His divisive nature became very obvious in his concluding remark when he tried to mention that we are being ruled by elder generation for the last 50 years and now is the time to rule by younger generation. He got his answer from the audience. They clearly indicated they had his big talk enough now. Now both the Kasurs must campaign full swing in all the settlements and big monastic institutions in India. Both the Kasurs must meet our general public in all those areas and public should choose the right and most deserving candidate to be our Kalon Tripa.
The Tibetan community of New York and New Jersey deserves kudos for organising an excellent debate.
As for the moderator I cannot say the same,of the three candidates the only candidate he interrupted multiple times was Dr.Lobsang Sangay for going over his time limit,but as for the other two candidates there was no interruption by this moderator when they too went over their time limits.
And as for the moderator asking Dr.Lobsang Sangay the questions first…who knows what was in his mind.
For the last few months I have been leaning towards voting for Dr.Lobsang Sangay and after watching the debate I still believe that he would be the most viable candidate to be the next Kalon Tripa due to a simple fact that we are in desperate need for change.
Kasur Tashi Wangdi in an ideal world should be the next Kalon Tripa, he has all the attributes of a good leader,his late entry into the Kalon Tripa race has hurt his candidacy.
Kasur Tenzing Tethong also deserves respect for having served our government and our cause for over 40 years and along with Dr.Lobsang Sangay and Kasur Tashi Wangdi is a strong candidate.
I just finished watching the recorded version of the NYC debate. If one’s unbiased and mature enough to understand what quality of response each candidate delivered, that TW and TNT far outperformed LS is quite evident. But between TW and TNT, TW mostly dwelled on status quo and either dodged or answered in politically correct manner some questions. TNT’s answers were straight, honest that reflected his commitment to true democracy in Tibetan polity, and are in tune with the ultimate aspirations of 6 million Tibetans!
The more I listen to Lobsang Sangay stronger my conviction becomes that he’s nothing but a mere opportunist who neither qualifies nor deserve to be Kalon Tripa. It’s a matter of debate how he got into Harvard. This guy claims to have ‘doctorate in law’ but he needs to be sent to local community college to take Political Science 101 class. He doesn’t believe in universally respected and practiced ONE PERSON ONE VOTE. And what’s more he wants to keep CHURCH AND STATE forever mixed in the constitution of future Tibet! Simply appalling! Did he really go to Harvard law school or Harvard Divinity School? If you guys really believe in the saying that Good Schools Don’t Necessarily Produce Good Students, then…here’s its poster boy!
Now, it’s been floating in internet for quite long that Lobsang Sangay is a man without principle and that he’s a liar. He’s into becoming Kalon Tripa of TGIE by any means imaginable – lie, boast, fake, what have you. A s much as his intellect is suspect, on the other hand the fact that monastic community comprises his major vote bank, the mockery of universally accepted democratic principle of ‘one person one vote’ by him and thus making himself completely intellectually fool is infact to shield their interest is equally possible!
So, deducing either way, here’s the guy: either Lobsang Sangay doesn’t know in true democracy each person has no more than one vote. Or, in his insatiable quest to become Kalon Tripa, he can go to any length to sell his conscience to secure the votes of monks so he could become Prime Minister, and lock Tibet nation in a messy constitution intertwined with religion and politics. Morally bankrupt guy.
Is this man we can entrust the office of kalon Tripa? NO WAY, Jose….only if you believe in taking Tibetan people and nation back to medieval period!
why did the moderator at NYNY katri debate kept groveling under TNT-TW, but squeezed LS in a tight corner, making him answer first, interrupting when time was over, addressing him as mere ‘LS’?
all because, that guy was very old, all this thoughts belong to 19 century, way behind the ways of modern code of ethics,civil thinking, and judgement. such people block CHANGE that we desperately need. No status quo at any cost.
Tsering Topgyal: of course we are in desperate need for change, but where do you expect changes to happen? In domestic or in foreign policy?
There is no winning and losing by one debate or any debate.
I do not select candidate through debate.
But i know the purpose of debate in a democratic system and should such be held in a fair manner and with integrity.
The moderator needs to learn more during his break time of dishwashing the universal code of ethics.
Overall a good job, but no match to VOA kunleng grill by Namgyal Shastri la. Karma Gyatso made it a very boring routine reminiscent of past meetings. A heavy use of rhetoric, little or no moderation. boring.
the questions from the audience was staple at best. the question should have been made public. I hope to see a debate of the three in Dharamsala with Namgyal Shastri as the interviewer, webcast with no technical difficulties and with questions open to world wide.
Overall, Tashi Wangdi la shined as a visionary and a practical leader. Visit http://nextkatri.wordpress.com
Sonam la
I am of the opinion that the last 50 years in exile our government under the leadership of His Holiness despite great success in the domestic front we could still have done better.
As for Foreign policy we could all debate on Rangzen & The Middle Path but there is one part we can all agree and that is the growing apathy towards our struggle,this disease of apathy will kill the hope we have for our country.
I lean towards Dr.Lobsang Sangay not because I consider him to be better than than the other candidates but simply because he has captured the hearts of many of our people and my hope is that this hope will transalate into all of us getting involved in our common struggle.
My personal choice in an ideal world would have been Kasur Tashi Wangdi.
Let me correct one of the assumption made about the NY debate.
The Moderator drew lots to see who will answer the question first, second, and third. You all saw that. So, I don`t understand LS confusion nor anybody else`. If you ask me if that is the right way to do it, I would certainly disagree. But to say it is not fair of the Moderator is not correct nor fair because that was the rule the group came up with and he wasn`t being unfair to any one candidate. He explained why when LS questioned about the order but I guess you guys were not listening as usual. Daveno and Old man, tell me honestly how many haloes did you see around LS. Come on, don`t be shy. 😛
One candidate came across as arrogant, quick to anger, quarrelsome, manipulative, and extremely vague on answers while trying to sound supremely confident and knowledgeable, and the most telling thing that happened was when he robbed one candidate of the customary applause after the candidate’s closing statement by cutting in with his own statement without waiting to be introduced by the moderator…..this crude, immodest, and startlingly rude behavior is in direct contrast to his constant boasting of how he encourages young people to respect Tibetan culture. I think most Tibetans should be able to guess who this candidate might be even if they had never seen the debate.
Tendhar.
I still support and will elect Lobsang Sangsay la.
I know you need to hear this!
Lobsang Sangay may have generated lots of interest and ‘captured many hearts’ in this Katri election that we never witnessed before, but that’s all there’s to it. It’s a tragedy that I cannot trust this guy beyond this point! As much as I want to thank him for bringing hoopla into race, I want to see him as lose in the election.
Lobsang Sangay is so much in rush and desperate to become Katri. They are not bad at all in itself. What bothers me is combination following to this rush and desperation:
1. His falsification of endorsements
2. lack of transparency as regards his dealings with China and China visit,
3. manipulation of settings of meetings and debate to have himself favorably placed in speaking order
4. lies about Harvard funding his overseas trips (ok, it may have sponsored couple of his overseas trips owing academic project and seminars but certainly not all his India visits)
5. his lack of courage to represent true feelings and aspirations of Tibetan people before the China
6. flirting between Rangzen and Middlepath…
7. Downright lies before the NY debate audience that ‘majority of tibs’ in Boston voted for him in prilm. Those who ‘signed’ on the said endorsement don’t actually support him but said rather signed to ‘please’ him. They said LS approached them with the text!
These are some I can think of now that internally bothers me to think he’s not playing by the rules to get to the top! And to downplay his lack of experience, he says leaders don’t need to have managerial skills, or prior leadership experience! He knows damn well that what he said had any drop of truth then…Harvard would have made him ‘senior research fellow’ right after his graduation, and not ‘junior research’. All this lies and disingenuity simply reflect badly on his morality and character!
I’m all for change. Change has taken root in our polity with the door to Katri made open to general public and transfer of all the political power on his personage by HHDL. I can foresee in 2016 Katri election more younger people equipped with modern education running for the office with better ideas how to lead. Let’s not rush this time. Electing Lobsang Sangay is not embracing ‘change’, but rewarding bad behavior and ‘allowing’ Bihari politics to take root in our infant democracy!!!!
Policy wise TNT represents change and given his past record of accomplishments and innovative ideas, let’s give him one more chance. If he failed to live upto our expectation, we can take him down in 2016. Perhaps then we may have bigger and better pool of youngster to choose from. Till then, by refusing to vote for Lobsang Sangay, let’s teach him in particular and all Tibetans in general a lesson that if you want to run for political office, PLAY BY THE RULES, be HONEST and show that you are man with INTEGRITY at least!!!
Do we really know each of these candidates?
Their private thoughts?
Their true feelings on issues?
What they might or might not do in the future? Do we really know much today?
Do we really believe that all three candidates are without flaws? or
that they have never uttered a white lie?
No one is perfect and for some who may still carry some hope…none in the future too.
As in most elections we elect leaders who we believe are right for that particular moment.
It could be a boring but ‘don’t rock the boat’ type of a leader or it could be a leader ‘who won’t stand for nonsense’ or it could be a leader who would inspire the people to do more.
The next Kalon Tripa will carry with him his personal baggage of strenght and flaws and the Tibetan ‘National Enquirer’ which I mean silly unfounded remarks by some on this blog like any will continue to follow.
next time, we need to investigate the background of moderators. Experience taught us that they can be easily bought off for a little sum. eg. namgyal shastri, VOA. he’s very treacherous, failing to live up to his expectations. And, what about the one during NY debate? Nothing better, equally dubious.
TNT is equally dubious. why can’t he come clear about his ‘corruption case’? why did he have to dessert Tibetan nation to make money in USA? said he needed money for his children’s education. why can’t he send his children to tcv schools? 99% tibetan children study in india. so, folks, think, think, think…do we need such a cheap fellow as katri? that will be ultimate shame.
everything around TNT is dark, right from the debate moderators to his campaign supports, not hesitating to pull unethical chords in fighting for their goal. let’s have LS. Let’s have a common man’s man, someone young, pragmatic. if he doesn’t do well, let’s take him down in 2016. TNT had his day already.
well i don’t feel that katri post is like a miss tibet post of fame and fortune. it’s a critical juncture in history and young guns can do anything. I think we need a experienced leader like TW to steer us clear of any trouble at this juncture.
I began with equal support for LS as much as for TW or TNT. I dont know them personally. I started studying each candidate closely, listened to their speeches, past records etc to narrow down to one. Based on these examinations and introspections, I found TNT to be best amongst them.
Now what lies inside the heart and mind of TNT or anyone is beyond my ability to know, and if i said I have arrived at the decision after knowing thier psychology n philosophy, then i m lying. I’m not super-natural being. So, if anyone of you know TNT idolizes Mao Zedong and privately thinks Tibet has always been part of China, please let me know. I’m dropping everything to take him off my list. now!
After you learn the rules of the road you get a learner’s permit to drive. This permit has many restrictions in order to limit the possibility of injury to the driver and to the public. And with this permit, you are authorized to use the roads for the purposes of taking driving classes from an instructor until you pass your driver’s test, and get a real driver’s license. In many areas of the world however, even this first license comes with certain restrictions to again minimize the chances of the new driver causing accidents and possible disasters, and is only granted a full privilege license after a year or two of driving without incidents. Even then, a regular license does not permit the person to operate buses, trucks and other heavy machinery. And it certainly does not allow the person to fly planes. Now we have a person who without a learner’s permit for an automobile, would like to take the controls of a jumbo jet full of men, women and children. And surprisingly, as if in a surreal dream, we have people saying that because of his youth and his having read books on the theory of flight, he should be given the chance to do it.
Now let me see…..where are the exit doors….and what was that about water landings and oxygen masks dropping…..hhhhmmm.
In Kunleng’s interview LS said very confidently that he was invited by IIT chennai to give a talk on Tibet. Which is a complete lie.
That talk was arranged by Tibet supporter Aasha Reddy on request of LS. He is not invited rather we requested IIT to give an opportunity . He actually request her to arrange a meeting with bar council of chennai but that did not work out.
Being a candidate for the highest post of the nation one can not tel lie.
with due apologies to lS supporters who also must be very disappointed i must say that LS is really not fit for Kalon Tripa post. I dont have anything agaisnt him and i wish him well but more and more i feel like its sounding like the diagnosis of a certain disorder.
old monk n daveno,
let’s try to think critically, reason effectively, communicate clearly, resolve issues intelligently, and construct thoughful, well-grounded beliefs. these core thinking and language abilities will enhance success in every area of tibetan life.
let’s focus on candidates’ credibility and manifesto, not rhetoric n hypes.
Are there any elected leaders in the world past or present who have not tweaked the truth in the heat of a campaign?
Or are there any of these leaders who in a campaign journeyd through months of speeches and interviews remembering every piece of details given in the past?
We have three candidates who are good Tibetans with an apparent desire to serve our cause.
Each of them have their strenghts and the flaws which are common to us all.
But calling any of them liars is in very poor taste and targeting any particular candidate with personal attacks that are unfounded is wrong.
TW: i was most disappointed after seeing the voa TW interview. the reason he gave to run in kalontripa was on an empty words, the nation cannot run on an empty words, that was the cheapest reason i have ever had. he doesn’t have credibility to judge which one is more impt.; the nation or his word. his memory is not serving him well and also his ear. final word; the more you stay in election the more you turn your integrity into ashes.
LS: he is like indian(zangmey) student, who say yes to everything. i think he should join laughter challenge afterwards.
TNT: Vote for TNT. easiest choice to made. dont read psychology, read his past experience and present interviews. he is the most sensible and credential.
every sensible tibetan when given option to choose one among donkey, horse n mule will go for horse TNT!
LS is a young Tiger, not a mule or donkey.
Ha ha ha!! Ha yo ya.!
@Average tenzin, Leadership is not a mechanical/technical position that you should relate to driving or pilot.Ofcourse i dont blame you.I respect your analytical efforts.
@G-rangzen,Lets do that and ask those TNT army or your avatar in phayul to stop those malicious personal attack on LS la. We all are gifted with capabilities to think negative and come up with the worst but its our respectful environment that we should preserve.
@Tashi, The easiest choice will end up as the worst choice! We are tibetan brought up with thukpa and momo, we dont say YES unnecessarily, we all have KUNCHOE SANGPO to adhere to.
@ SANGAY la,
You have been quoting many times with Chinese quote to demonize Kalon Tripa candidate – I think this is where you’re crossing the fine line of civility. Please refrain in future, I do agree you have right to say who you like and you would vote to. But at the same time when you put up your good opinion – be truthful and to the fact reasoning is very essential, by doing this you can have very good sleep at night.
Old Monk, young tiger if not tamed and trained well in time will turn out destructive.
We scrutinized candidates; we grill them as though we are seeking perfection and then we select the best. That’s how recruiters hire employees; congress/parliament confirms judges, or president or PM by voters everywhere. Flaws and imperfection are different story. They are with everyone.
Now if anyone is voting for someone considering he’s not perfect, then he better vote for all the three, or else he’s being biased. Because no one’s perfect.
@daveno, my comment was not meant to be analytical really. I was just offering some plain common sense through the use of simple euphemism.
A more analytical effort might go something like this: while we are in a difficult political situation and are tired of non progress on many fronts, we should not act with desperation by making an illogical and rash choice of choosing someone new simply because they are are not associated with past leadership. I see some of LS’s supporters who say, ‘give him a chance…what can get worse’ and are willing to close one’s eyes to the candidates lack of many normally requisite qualifications for a national leader, simply because they are sick of Dharamsala’s failings and the fact that after 50 years, there seems to be not even a pinhole of light at the end of the tunnel in resolving the Tibet situation. But that would not be a strategically smart decision and would be like cutting off your own nose to spite your face.
The potential truimph of LS over TNT would signify the eventual victory of proletarians over bourgeois class of our society. Let the common man rule the hill.
All who joined the ranks of Exile leadership assumed their power through aristocracy, blood-relation to HH the Dalai Lama, or clerical elitism, or right connections through wealth. No single person of humble beginnings ever smelled a whiff of power in the 2,137 years of the nation’s history. The repercussion of such suppression of working class is clear: a virtual nation in debris of corruption,stagnation,desolation.
Let’s give LS a chance. TNT served as kalon, but did he exhibited leadership qualities? No. Was he experienced? Doubtful? ( prolonged service is different from experience, there’re students in school who study 24 hours yet learn nothing, whereas others score top with 1 hour study). is he educated in conventional sense? No. His degree is class 12 graduate. is he innately brilliant? NO. His answers are always vague, and general in typical Tibetan Popo-momo fashion.
The long list of achievement in TNT’s name just came as accident of birth. being aristocrats, the likes of JN and TNT got education, so it’s their duty…look at TW lak, he has no such achievements to boast, but served more than TNT. All because TW isn’t from noble family.
so folks, don’t be foolish, don’t keep getting indoctrinated, rise up, rise up, rise up…proletarians, rise up. Let’s have a man who represents our life, our sufferings,our experiences…rather than someone so out of tough with common man.
I agree with Tashi. Tethong is by far the best choice out of the three. I know this will be a big surprise for everyone.
And yet, Old man, inspite of your dramatic Maoist rhetorics, Your man said he is going to follow exactly the same path made by those “Elitist” people. Maybe he wants to be one of those “Elitist” too. Aside from your laughable analysis of Tethong, are you sure there wasn’t any common people in the highest office? Maybe you might want to do a little research on this first?
@Old Monk – the CCP have a job opening for you. They are looking for rabid half baked socialists to carry out re-education programs in monasteries and villages across Tibet.
Old monk, do you know that LS is going around saying that he is himself related to Penor Rinpoche and his wife is related to Bhutanese royal family and also descendent of first Tibetan king Songsten Ganpo. If you think, I am making this up, just ask the current family members. LS is not your average proletariat that pretends to be. LS is successful, purely due to the stupidity of people like you.
laughing buddha, see your lie has busted right in front of you–who said first Tibetan King is Songtsen Gompo? He’s 33rd.
When you fabricate lies, ensure you get at least factual data correct. All the lies you people make about LS won’t get far, one day, like today, this will bust, and pheonix of truth will rise up from ashes of defamation. May Dr. LS lead us all to Lhasa, and may estranged brothers drink chang together soon.
70,000 tibetans will vote this time.
40,000 will go to TNT! rest
can be shared between LS and his lover TW! hope this is gud news to daveno n old monk!
minds are changing!
now asli temdrel sangpo shedrak rey!
Grangzen- I know you suk at math.
55625 will vote in the final.
(Only handful of NA Tib will vote-Many have to work Overtime,drive yellow cab,blue cab and many in India has to go to Ludhiana and bangkok its bus..time for them)
29897 will vote for Lobsang Sangay.
15485 will vote for TNT
10243 will vote for TW
All three has gained some vote and TW gained the most of the new vote and some switch from LS & TNT.
Lobsang Sangay la is The Kalon Tripa.
Old Monk, I don’t think it will be safe for you to go to Lhasa to drink chang with ‘estranged brothers’ if you plan on talking about proletarians rising up. They have had 50 years of the Chinese proletariat saying that even as they rape, loot, and destroy our nation, and will not let you finish your first sentence.
Good piece for all..
Is LS a scholar in real sense?.
http://www.tibetanpoliticalreview.org/project-updates/areviewofdrlobsangsangay%E2%80%99spublishedscholarlyworks
what was tethong doing in Beijing and Lhasa in 2000? He concealed his trip from the voters. Past kalon tripa suddenly in China, he should clarify on that.
Boston Tibetan Association has just released this:
http://www.bostontibet.org/img/TAB_Letter%20for%20Public.jpg
1/11/11
CHONI TSULTRIM GYATSO
As Kalon Tripa debate is heated up in Tibetan communities around world as a Tibetan I am not different. Sometimes even in my office during lunch break few of Tibetans come together and heated up with different opinion on candidates’ way of handle questions and their political views. After listen carefully to all the debates and read a lot about all the candidates and rechecked some of realities that we face at 21st century what is that we really need as political refugees and more importantly inside Tibet. l made my decision and I wanted to share with all of you.
I truly respect other two candidates Tashi Wangdu and Tenzin Tethong for their priceless services in exile government and contributions to the Tibetan communities. However, we can’t keep them forever. When time comes changes needs to happens and I think time is now to pass load on to younger generation’s shoulders while H.H alive.
I really don’t understand why people still so scare to pass on the political power to next generation. I remember while I was newly came to Dharamsala people talked a lot about first directly pointed Kalon Tripa and think that H.H will become powerless if Kalon Tripa hold all the power.
Second time worry was about directly voted Kalon Tripa by the people and now is third time scaring to pass power on to next generation. Another word don’t want give up power and hold forever. I just don’t understand why people so scare about and keep vote people who already got chance. why we want repeat history again?
If we want change then this is time. We don’t have to wait for another few years. Time is running out. We have the power to change, so please be aware what is going on in Tibet and who is right one to vote on to face China. We have seen already Lobsang Sangay’s political talent and reconnection with Chinese scholars and leaders. Let be clear to reduce people’s suffering in Tibet and ultimately free Tibet is only through Decalogue, reconnection and reconciliation with Chinese people and China’s leaders based on H.H middle way of approach. Lobsang Sangay has shown us his capability and natural talent on that.
There are people working around clock to support other candidates. I mean that is nothing wrong but sad thing is attentionally created fault rumor about Dr.Lobsang Sangay’s green book, marriage, designation at Harvard, his political view and there are also people saying that he is not majored Doctorate in Juridical Sciences.
All these baseless rumors being cleared. We all know he is perfectly fit on Kalon Tripa position. As we now know that he is specialized on international law, Human rights, democracy and conflict resolution and more importantly he is expert on Sino-Tibetan relations. These are the very critical qualifications to solve Tibet issue on international stage.
I mean I think there might be some sore of partiality going on without think about our future and changeability we need on political leadership. This is very sad thing as I said and obviously I can’t stop people vote whoever they wanted to vote on but one thing I have to tell all friends out there you will be huge disappoint and regret if nothing happens vote people already got chance to shine in the past 30 years.
Thus, I highly recommend all dear friends now is time to move on and vote for Lobsang Sangay la. He is a total package that we are looking for.
I am so excited that this is going to be a new chapter in Tibetan history to prove the world that we Tibetans are not theoretical or serfdom society rather than a legitimate democratic society. And this will also answers all the questions that China’s propagandas.
Lobsang Sangay has said “ Kalon Tripa is a political leader not a manager”. his statement penetrated my heart and let me realized what political leader is all about. There are so many managers (Kalons) in every department why would Kalon Tripa worry too much about manage internal tasks rather than push political issue to the international stages.
Some people think that Lobsang Sangay la lack of experience but when I asked people very detail about what experiences they are talking about. They really have no answer at last. We have so many examples in front of us Obama only two years in political now be able to leader United States. Look back some of Kalon Tripa and Kalons in the past. Who had ultimate 21st century political education? Who attained Harvard law school ? Who had political experience ? Some of Kalons barely be able to read whatever is on paper without paper whole world is blacked out.
One time Samdoung Rinpochen said “there are Kalons and Chethu need to do homework on Tibetan if they have to give speech next day.” Kalon Tripa is somebody has expressive talent not every single word on paper everyday to face public.
Kalons in the past learnt some years Buddhist philosophy in monastery and regular college degree, nobody has been expert on international law, politic, democracy, human rights and conflict resolution.
Therefore now we have right candidate and it is right time to move on the next Chapter.
Thanks
TPR editors finally revealed their background as Jd & Jzee followers.
They are making hugh noices every now and then, but i am wondering why aren’t they on Katri candidate list when they claim to know more on stuff.hm.mmm!
public sab kuchh janta hai!!
It does not seem correct to criticize someone who works in wallstreet and knows the depth of business world ..on his statement on doing business with china.This guys knows what works in pratical business world and witnessing stuff every day.
Thats why, history books are mostly cooked up by few who claims to know when they dont even live that life.
Lobsang Sangay has shot a movie of himself, and it’s being distributed by his campaign managers to any email address they can think of. It seems it’s thier final pitch before the election to convince (forced) us that Lobsang Sangay is a “khewang”! LOL!!!!
Choni Tsultrim Gyatso, you should watch it. It may further cement your conviction that LS is indeed a “scholar”! 🙂 The link is below. Enjoy!
To me, Lobsang Sangay appears to be a conman now, whose ‘scholarship’ tag after getting busted by TPR is now into making movies to delude us, a move akin to making of movie “Serf” by China to brainwash people…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_laNC23654w
@Sangay, what about Kudrak hiring Mobster/mafia to get to the power.
there’s the news about Tethong la’s visit to Beijing in the year 2000. I don’t know whether it was done in official capacity, or, on a personal business. any further information on Tethong la’s visit to Beijing?
Any detail will be helpful. Thanks.
@Daveno #430
What do you mean the TPR editors “finally revealed their background”????
You make them sound like a secret conspiracy. But their names and backgrounds have ALWAYS been on that website for anyone to see: http://www.tibetanpoliticalreview.org/the-team
Or are you just saying whatever comes to yr mind to attack TPR?
Diwana of Lobsang Sangay,
“what about Kudrak hiring Mobster/mafia to get to the power” – is this story line of next film project of Lobsang Sangay and Chamchas Motion Picture Production Company to take the masses for ride??? LOL!
Anyway, do give me heads-up when you release it! 🙂
@Sangha of kudrak,
I am pretty sure you are at level 8.5 out of 10 to reach the kudrak status.
work hard..you will eventually be rewarded.
Choni Tsultrim Gyatso #429,
Let me comment on your thoughts.
— “I really don’t understand why people still so scare to pass on the political power to next generation”.
If this is true for a few old-timers, it is definitely inaccurate with most of Lobsang Sangay’s critics. His lack of experience has been condemned, not his age. It is only himself and his supporters that fool around with the age factor, playing the victims of an “anti-young” system.
Additionally, youth is not forcibly a guarantee of better ruling: Adolf Hitler was 44 when appointed chancellor of Germany while Winston Churchill was 66 when elected prime minister of United Kingdom. The first destroyed Europe, the second saved it.
— “I just don’t understand why people so scare about and keep vote people who already got chance.”
Sometimes you re-elect a leader not because s/he is good, but simply because other candidates are worst. As simple as that.
— “We have seen already Lobsang Sangay’s political talent and reconnection with Chinese scholars and leaders.”
Organizing conferences is not a political skill but a talent for coordination. Additionally, Sangay’s guest lists didn’t include Chinese leaders, but exclusively students and scholars, most of them living outside mainland China. Not much to “reduce people’s suffering in Tibet”, uh…?
— “Lobsang Sangay has said ‘Kalon Tripa is a political leader not a manager’”.
Here, you get carried away by false hope and by your lack of political perspective. In terms of foreign policies, these matters are — and will be — taken care of by His Holiness, even if he resigns in 2011 as announced.
In other words, the future Kalon Tripa will have the power to lead Tibetans into organic farming, into education reforms and into other domestic affairs, but won’t have much to do as leading them towards the freedom of Tibet, expect maybe to lead activists back in their home during Chinese official visits in the US, in the name of “constructive engagement” as Samdhong justified it during Jiang Zemin and Hu Jintao visits (2002 and 2006).
— “Obama only two years in political [sic].”
Badly wrong. Barack Obama was elected to Illinois Senate in 1996. This means a 14-year of government experience before being elected as president.
— “One time Samdoung Rinpochen said ‘there are Kalons and Chethu need to do homework on Tibetan if they have to give speech next day.’”
Jamyang Norbu already said the same thing 27 years ago in an article entitled “A Revolt Long Ago”:
“I don’t know how well this advice would be received, but I feel that all the ministers and deputies concerned should practice their speeches well in advance and at least try to inject some enthusiasm for the exalted sentiments they are expressing on that day.” (Tibetan Review, March 1984)
I guess, however, that Samdhong was speaking for himself; when half of the people have a problem to understand “the depth” of his speeches, it is hard to refer to him as a good orator.
— “Nobody has been expert on international law, politic, democracy, human rights and conflict resolution.”
In itself, having a university degree doesn’t entitle anyone to be an “expert”. Expertise is gained through experience. Sometimes without the slightest degree. Jamyang Norbu, for instance, has no university degree but through his writings he is internationally acclaimed as an expert on Tibetan political affairs. Sangay, with only a Harvard degree in his pocket and not a single year of government experience, should only be entitled to a post of advisor or consultant.
choni,
organizing conferences is very very easy. let me tell u how.
1. call student govt to book the hall. any vacant day is yours. harward encourages it. its free from sound system to chairs to restrooms.
2. post a few posters near campus cafeteria, around 100 tibetan and chinese students mostly from harvard wil show up.
3. have a topic
4. get your friend as moderator or introducer
5. speak for 15 minutes with some humor here n there
6. q n a session 45 minutes
7. at the end, say a couple thank you lines
n go home! no big deal.
@436
Juchen Thupten was Kalon Tripa; Sonam Topgyal la was Katri and now Samdhong Rinpoche who’s completing 2nd year term in couple of months. I’m sure there have been other as well in between but I don’t recall their names. So, in over last at least 20 years TGIE has been led by non-Kudrak PMs, and during that time, if what you ‘Red Guards’ of Lobsang Sangay like us to believe that there are people who want to ‘resurrected kudrak system’, then why no one of them ever rose up and demanded these non-kudraks be never made Katri???
The fact that no one ever opposed but actually overwhelmingly elected SR is crystal clear indication, even for starter, that ‘kudrak this kudrak that’ is non-existent issue in our exile community and no one even cares about it anymore. The fact that the non-Kudraks were able to become Katri is a disclosure of sort that the office of Kalon Tripa is a ‘throne of Gaden’ which is open to anyone with ability! So elementary that it’s like adding two and two and the answer at once pops up in your mind: Four!
TNT is best suited for the job because he’s a proven leader unlike the rest. But you want someone who now increasingly looks like a conman to become PM. And since you can’t have educated debate based on facts and records, you dig out something that doesn’t even exist to smear TNT.
So, listen up Diwana, Parwana, Mehbooba and Ishiquis of Lobsang Sangay. With TPR stripping the last layer of his phony “scholar” tag, there’s hardly anything to talk about Lobsang Sangay now, so dont resort to creating fiction. Stick to your recent campaign strategy of making movies. I liked it. LS may not be comparable with TNT in real life, at least through movies you can make him ‘Rajnikanth’! 🙂
@ Master of Sangha,
I cannot change kudrak to non-kudrak, or shampa to non-shampa.
“TNT is best suited for the job because he’s a proven leader unlike the rest”.
I should vote for TNT on your one sentence definition of a proven leader.
Do not define leader that suits your purpose.
Educated shangha, did you do your morning prayers to become one.
Hi Gyalkarb
We have never heard you are organizing conferences with any one. If it is very very easy then where were you? why didn’t do it?
Let me tell you it is easy to bulk shit saying “very very easy” but why didn’t you make phone calls and book hall. what is hell you are living in? don’t you think that you don’t have responsibility?
Where you waste your vacant day? Do Drug? You don’t have to be in and support by Harvard. you should know where you are and where you came from.
Who the hell stopped you post your posters. I f you are in that position then you will how buster you are and how stupid thing you said here.
“3. have a topic’ I don’t think you know who you are and where are you now.You instant comment here rather need to go to hospital to mental treatment.
“get your friend as moderator or introducer”
Where is your friends moderators xxxx….? Zero.
I can’t even look at your comment. It is so disgusting to look at.
“n go home! no big deal.” you said.
It is not big deal people like you but this is really big deal to me and my family.
In history people like you said “not big deal” that is why we are in this situation today?
I know it is not big deal to you because you are in safety place but million people are suffering and pain and in fear under China’s mistreatment.
Please if you have any logical things to say i am more than welcome but do not act like childish.
If TNT wins, it’s going to be same old shit.
If LS wins it’s going to be chaoitic and disaster, earthquake in Tibetan exile community.
chomey jhapmey choni,
why dont you take things in context? you made conference hopping sound so herculean. thats why.
trust me it is not my intention to offend the beliefs, attitudes n values of any monkish bastard whose rustic approach to debatal exchange n depth-less style of argument dates back to prehistoric sedrega sum! met enough of u. every time you open your mouth for an argument, your naive reasoning sickens me to say the least. you monkish lack the concept of holistic and contextual approach. one reason why i go black n white, one excuse why i get too subjective, one reason why i go rhetorical despite my appreciation for cool objective n logical conclusions is to titillate those antique brains! take the last shot for i wont respond. juvenile!
Christophe – your one two punches against post #429 was fun to read! Just goes to show how some people make hasty judgement with very shallow understanding of what really is going on. With the choice we have, TN-la is definitely the right person for the post of Kalon Tripa at this juncture of our Tibetan history. Kalon Tripa post is not a lab for experimenting with unproven leadership quality claims. It seems LS-la’s “claim to fame” is his PHD and his experience in organising conferences and giving lectures. Whereas many of us (including LS-la) have enjoyed the fruits of TN-la leadership in putting together various organisations such as ICT, Tibet Fund, Fulbright scholarships for Tibetans, to name a few. Stacking this along side LS-la’s claim to fame is a difference of thumb and pinky finger.
And Kalon tripa office is not a semi-monastery or Lhakhang for popola to perform their Ghenchoe activities.
Honesty of “collective efforts” is missing everytime, thanks to TW’s humble tibetaness.Otherwise, half-baked in western attitude of over-exaggeration is infecting our culture blessed with humility and honesty.
I am jealous of anyone who got PHD, cause i dont have one and what i have is just a mundane certification.So i respect those who got one.
I’m proud of any Tibetan who is successful, incl. PhD, because I’m Tibetan.
But don’t you think it would be the most embarassing act of the Tibetans to vote for someone only because of a PhD?
We have nowadays so many educated Tibetans, why not consult all Tibetans with a PhD on how they would rate the PhD in relation to lead the exile government.
war now, war forever.
Drive back those bastards from the land of ruddy faced.
@446, Very bery true!
However, wouldn’t you consider that degree or academic achievement as an additional advantage to consider?
I wouldn’t consult all of them.They are good in their own field of study but they are not “all-knowing entity”.
a Ph.d no matter how shoddy is better than a class 12 certificate, as in case of tethong la.
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